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Discussion Starter #1
Now that I've started posting I find I've got some more questions. I seem to remember that one of the brake upgrade paths for P38A was PBR calipers that were bigger disc, dual piston, and did not need a 17" rim. I originally planned on 18" rims but now I like my 16"'s. I never worry about hitting potholes or curbs. These calipers must OEM on some car in the US? A bunch of Chevy's use dual piston PBR's. Does anyone know already? I know I will have to replace my discs soon.

Thanks!
 

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Aren't our calipers already dual piston? :think:
 

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Thor001 said:
Now that I've started posting I find I've got some more questions. I seem to remember that one of the brake upgrade paths for P38A was PBR calipers that were bigger disc, dual piston, and did not need a 17" rim. I originally planned on 18" rims but now I like my 16"'s. I never worry about hitting potholes or curbs. These calipers must OEM on some car in the US? A bunch of Chevy's use dual piston PBR's. Does anyone know already? I know I will have to replace my discs soon.

Thanks!
JE Engineering did some 4 pistons caliper but you need 17"
AP Racing does some too but you lost ABS
 

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rrtoadhall said:
Aren't our calipers already dual piston? :think:
yes. I was pleasantly surprised when I changed the pads last year. That and the fact that I got about 80k miles out of the stock pads, and still had over 1/4" of pad left...probably could have gone another 20k safely.
 

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I would carefully consider what you are trying to accomplish before starting a project to change brake components. I see many slapping aftermarket rotors with holes or slots that aren't going to do anything for braking performance or adding new calipers that may or may not do anything. The rotor size, caliper design, and pad materials were carefully selected by LR engineers to provide good braking, fade resistance, and pad life. Of course this is a balancing act like most other systems are. I think you should start with a specific goal and do things that get you there. For instance, larger rotors with absorb and dissipate more heat making the system more resistant to fade. But if you are not having brake fade issues then why go to a larger rotor? Typically, the quickest and cheapest way to reduce stopping distances is going to be changing pad materials. If you are willing to tolerate shorter life spans for pads and rotors, a more aggressive pad material will provide shorter stopping distances. But this pad is going to create more heat so possibly you will end up needing larger rotors if you use the brakes really hard. This is why I think it should be looked at as a system with a goal in mind. As far as replacing calipers, I doubt you would gain anything or maybe even decrease performance. The only reason I can think of to replace them would be to go to a more rigid caliper (for cars with known weak calipers) or if you are changing to a new rotor/caliper/pad design that requires it. Of course even before looking to change pad materials, you should look at your tires. Crappy tires with excellent brakes isn't going to stop as good as stock with good tires. If you off road and run aggressive off road tread designs, consider a second set of rims/tires for road use. Probably cheaper and more effective than an expensive brake kit.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I drive stop and go city traffic about 50 miles every day. I think the highly engineered P38A brakes suck. I really have to stomp on my brakes when I want to stop. I think the ABS sucks over bumps on pavement. I do like them in the snow. I'm running brand new cooper discoverer tires in 275/70. The tires are heavier with more contact patch than the crap OEM tires. This means right there that my brakes are working harder than stock. My front pads don't last very long. They are the stock pads. I want a lot more brake and a lot more pad life. I havent even gotten around to doing any performance mods on the engine. If I cant upgrade to more power calipers with a larger pad surface area then I will definitely go with PBR slotted, vented, and drilled discs and a performance pad. I just don't think its going to be enough in the long run.
 

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Sounds more like you have an issue with your system. My brakes are very light to the touch, sure footed and capable. On road trips I can easily have 4 adults, luggage, camping gear on the roof and a trunk full of food. I have never had any reason not to trust my factory brakes.
 

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2002-2005 Range Rover MkIII / L322
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Agreed with Toad.

My brakes are fantastic. Before I changed out the fluid they were a bit mushy, but now they're firm and stop very well. Like I said before, over 80k miles on the stock pads, and they easily had another 20k in them.

If you're expecting a 2.5 ton truck to stop like a 1.5 ton car with 4 pot Brembos it's never going to happen...but it is a darn good system to start with.

By the way... since you're not the original owner, and I'm assuming your rig has in excess of 100k miles...how would you know what the OEM tires were like? Are you sure you have OEM pads? Did you install them yourself? Is your accumulator and pump up to snuff? Also...your new tires are probably 6 lbs heavier per tire. Rotating mass has a huge effect on braking performance and acceleration.
 

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I'm with rrtoad, sounds like your system is not operating to its potential. A stock Rover is certainly better than any Chevy I have driven. Suburbans are borderline dangerous in my opinion. Get the system flushed, new fluid, and bled. Your OEM calipers might benefit from being rebuilt. Then start with different pads. Drilling, slotting, and whatever to stock diameter rotors are marketing gimmicks with more potential downside than up.
 

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NorCal RR said:
Drilling, slotting, and whatever to stock diameter rotors are marketing gimmicks with more potential downside than up.
Somebody finally gets it. :thumb:
 

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I completely overhauled my brake system about 3 weeks ago put brembo rotors(non drilled,i think drilled are useless unless your racing), New pads, flushed the brake fluid, and the brake feel is nice and firm, barely have to touch it and it stops on a dime. All the people that have driven my P38 always complain about how stiff the brake feel is, but imo that's how it should be, all the new suv Ive driven have had the squishiest brakes pedal travel and literally have to pedal to the metal to stop them.
 
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