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1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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Try your local hydraulics shops for those sort of things, too.
 

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1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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A screw driver/ blunt chisel and a hammer will undo the tank nut, then do back up by hand and same method to tighten, I changed my pump with no problem and saved a wad of cash.
 

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Discussion Starter #23
Thanks Dave you are a star... will order the kit from Island 4x4...
Another one of my friends has suggested the hammer and screwdriver method too.... I may try that but if it looks like it'll cause too much damage then I will order the proper tool..
Thank You everyone for the info... The new pump should arrive tomorrow so will see how it goes.. then when I get the new nut n olive kit as Dave suggested, I will finish it off.
I will update the thread once that is done...
I have also noticed that the rear end sinks if left overnight, but the front stays up.. will do a spray check for air leaks tomorrow when I fit the new glow plug relay.

Chris I got your message about the leaky sunroof... I will check the areas you suggested and will keep you updated.. Thanks...
 

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The proper tool from Paddock is only £16 so there is no need to use the hammer and chisel method. It fits other Landrover models as well.
 

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Discussion Starter #25
Thanks for all the info guys.. update as follows:
New in tank fuel pump is now in and working a treat... no air in the fuel lines... woohoo..
Now however.... The FIP seems to have a leak... every two seconds or so, there is a drip of fuel from the underside of the FIP.. The car cut out on me yesterday just driving at 20mph then let off the throttle.. and then everything cut out. It started again after a couple of tries so drove the extra quarter mile home. Hooked up the iCarsoft machine and there was indeed a FIP fault... took a look at it and sure enough I noticed the dripping.
Onwards and upwards I guess... Will have to sort this before I sort the leaky roof... Oh joy....
I don't fancy paying another £800 to get the FIP repaired so am going to look into servicing it myself... back to the books...
 

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1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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Discussion Starter #27
Hi Kretslopp, Thanks for the info... I have read through the thread... Hopefully it will be one of the seals you mention.
As I look at the FIP, standing at the front wheel of the car, the injector pipes are on my right hand side and the fuel supply pipe is on my left hand side. Looking towards the lower part of the pump, there is a circular plate. Directly below this circular plate, but underneath the pump, is where it is dripping from.
It does not seem to be coming from the circular plate though..... I will be completely drying the area off and cleaning with brake cleaner and then start the vehicle up and try to establish where exactly the leak is.
I will keep the thread updated...
 

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Discussion Starter #28
The area indicated is the diamond shaped plate with a circular centre and a bolt either side of the plate is where the leak seems to be coming from. The upper two seals are dry as a bone.
When I get a chance, I will look at the RAVE manual to see if there is a seal behind this plate..

FIP2.jpg
 

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1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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Ok, that is a cover for the timing device plunger. There is a nice pictogram in the workshop manual BMW diesel section which tells what is what on the FIP.

If you look at this gasket kit, you can see the two gaskets that are a special shape for the solenoid housing and also 2 green O-rings and one black O-ring that are roughly the same size. It has to be one of those for this cover where yours is leaking.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Diesel-injection-pump-rebuilt-kit-BMW-325TDS-2-5TD-BMW-525TDS-BMW-725TDS-M51D25-/321754379807
 

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Discussion Starter #30
Apologies for the late reply to my thread but have been away for a week and also bad weather has halted some of the work..

Thank you Kretslopp, that seal kit was just the thing... FIP now has no leaks.. Took it for a drive and it performs great... However, the injector light comes on for a second or two when I power up hills and at the same time, there is a slight loss of acceleration and then it picks right up again... I have spoken to a friend and he seems to think that this could be due to cheap fuel as they can be a little sensitive...
Not sure if this is correct, so any thoughts on this would be great...

Then its just the water ingress at the drivers side (UK) sun visor...

Cheers All.....
 

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You're welcome. Glad I could help.


Cheap fuel? Where do you fill your vehicle? At a used airline fuel recycling plant?
If you fill at a petrol station the fuel ought to fulfill the EN590 standard. https://www.ipu.co.uk/en590/
And it should not cause what you're describing.

If it started after the gasket changes of the FIP it's probably related to that.
I quote the workshop manual about malfunctioning sensors:

Malfunctions

If a fault occurs in any of the following circuits:
manifold absolute pressure sensor, fuel temperature
sensor or coolant temperature sensor, the ECM will
provide substitute values. In the case of a faulty
throttle position sensor, start of injection sensor or
injection timing device, the engine will run at a
reduced performance level.

If the servo unit potentiometer or servo unit fails, the
injection system is deactivated. The engine shuts
down as a result.
If I interpret that paragraph correctly the Injection light should light if something is wrong with the highlighted section. And certainly the last part but in that case the engine would stop.
That should narrow it down a bit.
 

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The FIP timing is altered by the position of the top cover. You may not have put it back in exactly the same position. Bit of trial and error required I think. It can be advanced and retarded by sliding it backwards and forwards.
It is a good idea to fill the tank up now and again with premium diesel either Shell or BP. The detergents help clear the nozzles.
I occasionally run on a veg oil mix but have never had an injector warning light come on.
What do you mean by cheap diesel? Red diesel or kerosene! Cheap supermarket diesel in the UK is OK.
 

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Discussion Starter #33
Hi All, thanks for the replies... The 'Cheap fuel', was suggested to me from a guy that used to work at landrover.. To be honest I was not sure if this would cause an issue. We are quite remote where we live and the nearest fuel is a Co-op shop type filling station... we run our other landrovers on it no problem.

Over the weekend the iCarsoft V2.0 machine has the following:

8E - ECU has logged engine speed needle lift sensor fault. Break or short on line. Plug connection or at needle lift sensor.
Crank sensor signal indicates different engine speed.


I have unplugged the needle lift sensor connector and cleaned it up and then reconnected it and inspected the wires as far as I could.... This made no change, still the same error.

I have ordered a new Crank Sensor over the weekend as this was the cheapest option, so hopefully it is this that is causing the issue. The needle lift sensors are approx £250 to replace.... The crank sensor was £30....

Will replace this when it arrives and then post an update... Again, Thank you all, without places like these, people like me would be struggling even more...
 

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A couple of questions: Was the FIP removed from the engine and timed correctly afterwards with dial gauge?
How was the solenoid housing adjusted after the seal change?
How is the idle?

dave3d said:
The FIP timing is altered by the position of the top cover.
I assume you meant fuel quantity and not timing?
 

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Discussion Starter #35
Hi Kretslopp, I did not remove the FIP or the top section of it, the picture I posted was from another thread, I just used it to point out where the leak was from.
So the FIP has not been changed in any way for timing or fuel quantity. All I needed to do in the end was tighten the fuel input line and the two bolts on the cover I outlined but I still have the seal kit just in case I need it.
The idle is at 748 revs and is stable as well as the engine running fine apart from this issue with the injector light coming on for just a second when you power up a hill or when stationary if you take the revs up quickly and release the throttle quickly. When driving along normally, all is fine, its just when you come to a steep hill.
I find it all quite confusing as the symptoms suggest fuel quantity but the diagnostic machine is telling me sensors, complicated even more, by more than one sensor controlling the fuel. When I think I understand how it works, it kicks me up the butt.... :)
 

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Huh! So that problem must be an old one.
Let’s back it up a bit and read through your original post.

Hi all, I have just joined the P38 fraternity with my very recent purchase of a 1998 diesel variant... As per usual there are a few issues that need sorting and indeed may well be connected.
I bought it from a trusted friend who has told me it has had a new engine approx 30K miles ago and he had no issues with it running until he noticed a leak in the fuel injection pump about 3 months ago.
He duly had this rebuilt at a cost of around £800 and since then it started randomly losing power and on a few occasions has cut out on him. He then parked it on his drive and bought another vehicle to use, with the intention of maybe fixing the Rangie when he had the time. A few months later here we are...
Ok, so down to facts...
He tells me it runs rough sometimes and occasionally cuts out, it loses power going up....
After you fixed the electric lift pump which makes it easier to start and all the leaks from overflow hoses which ensures you don’t get air in the system and the leaking FIP itself you still have the original problem to deal with.

If this power problem occurred after the pump was overhauled one begin to suspect what was done with the pump. Is it timed correctly? Does the electronic timing device work as it should ensuring that it fires the injectors when it’s supposed to?

Or is it a fault in the fourth injector as the fault code says? I don’t know.
 

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Discussion Starter #37
Hi Kretslopp, thanks for the reply.. The Crank sensor arrived today so I will be fitting that tomorrow morning and then start her up and plug in my iCarsoft machine and see what it says... What you say makes perfect sense, it makes it easier to get someones point of view from the outside, I think they sometimes see the problems clearer.
It feels like I am going round in circles.. :)

Yes the original problem is there, although it no longer runs rough and drives fine. Prior to what I have done, it had no power at all... probably due to the electric pump..

I wondered if the issue is with the wiring loom somehow, as the error suggested a break in the line or short on the needle lift sensor. When I checked the plug connector and cleaned it thoroughly with electrical contact cleaner, all seemed good. Being colour blind hinders me when it comes to chasing wires around cars :)

Or would this fault read the same if the sensor itself has failed??? Not sure...

I will update the thread tomorrow at some point..

Cheers
 

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Discussion Starter #38
Update as follows:

Fitted a new Crank Position Sensor(without removing the bracket) this morning and then plugged the iCarsoft V2.0 in and started the Rangie up.

Under Fueling 1 I got the following: At Idle of 753 revs
Fuel quantity feedback 63
Current fuel quantity 4.75
Fuel quantity compared 26.25

Under Fueling 2 got the following: At idle of 753 revs
SWG Set Point 2995.20
SWG Actual 2680
Injector set point 2.25
Injector Actual 7.75
Timing mode 13.33%

Under General got the following: At idle of 753 revs
Needle Lift 727.97
Crank Speed 727.97
Both of these values alternated to 750.72 and then back to 727.97 in unison

Also had these two errors:

88 Fuel Quantity Actuator fault code stored when the control deviation exceeds a fixed limit value. May involve both electrical or mechanical defects in the injection pump.

90 Injection timing deviation, engine speed derived from needle lift sensor signal implausible when compared to engine speed derived from crank position sensor.

Whilst the engine was running I throttled up sharply a few times and the injector warning light did not come on but the diagnostic still shows the errors after clearing them. So now that I have eliminated the Crank sensor as this is new, do I presume that the FIP is still at fault and I need to get in touch with the company that refurbished it.... or am I still looking at a possible issue with the needle lift sensor?...

Any advice would be great...
 

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I’m not that familiar with electronic diagnosis on this engine. I don’t have equipment myself so some terms I had to do a google search for.

But one thing stands out and that’s static timing at 13%.
When the FIP is timed correctly that value should lie between 40-55%.
Below 40 = too advanced timing.
Above 55 = too retarded timing.

That should be addressed.
 

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Sorry, it was supposed to be 45-55%.
Read through the nanocom diagnostics manual and this is what it says about SWG setpoint:

“SWG set point (mV): The current SWG Set Point value over a range of 0 to 5000 mille- volts. The SWG is the Control Sleeve Travel sensor. This value is the value which the
• EDC ECU has determined it should be getting back from the sensor. This value should be below 1,500 mille-volts after approximately 20 seconds.”

Yours is around 3000mV.

https://nanocom-diagnostics.com/downloads/preview/p38-bosch-edc-nanocom-evolution
 
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