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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

I bought the p38 with the EAS converted to springs, but it looks like everything is still on there. Am I safe to remove the Air tank? What other parts am I safe to remove to trim some weight off of her?
 

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1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Well, the very best thing to remove would indeed be.....The Springs!
Then, you put the air bags back and have a full on P-38 the way it was designed to be!

However, if you were insistent, the tank could go as well as the pump and valve body if still fitted.
Don't forget the height sensors and the linkages as they are really massive.

Seriously though, these things are tanks, and shedding a few pounds will give you an unmeasurable improvement.
Tank, valves and pump are worth something to someone who appreciates the EAS, so don't toss them out.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Well, I was told shedding some lbs will help with the MPG since the added weight of the 20' rims hurt the MPG
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

You are never going to see enough of a difference in fuel economy to offset the labour and wasted time. You will get further by simply driving conservatively and making sure your rig is properly maintained and tuned.
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

If you want to improve the fuel economy, put the air suspension back on (far lighter than those stupid bedsprings) and fit the proper tyres.

As RRToadHall says, just about nothing short of having a lighter right foot will improve the fuel economy of these cars. They're heavy and they're as aerodynamic as a garden shed. That said, on petrol I can get around 24mpg according to the trip computer, which ties in approximately with what it takes in fuel.

The coil springs are expensive. Your insurance will now be expensive. Your Range Rover will handle badly, have a harsh ride and have its headlights pointing anywhere but where you need them to be. Those springs were a waste of money. A coil spring kit over here - a cheap one, at that - is around £250 which translates to about 200l of petrol or nearly 400l of gas! Petrol prices in the US are cheaper and Rangie bits are more expensive, so you'll see even more petrol for the cost of those springs.

How much of a difference do you expect taking a couple of kilos off a 2.5 tonne vehicle will make?
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Oh yea,
As long as we are gonna be beating up on you.......
I bought an 2000 with springs and 20 inch bling wheels (It was a good deal, and the wife liked it)
The ride was so harsh I refused to drive it!
The wife really preferred mine and would take it into town instead of hers! (16 in steel wheels and slightly over sized tires) Great ride on air!
I recently picked up a mint untitled parts 00 with stock 16 in wheels and fitted them to her car with new stock sized tires.
Better, but according to herself, not good enuf! (Got mine back 'tho)
The other reason for getting the 00 was that aside from bags, the air system is fully functional. the PO destroyed each bag in turn by jacking the body up to do brakes.
An unethical inde here in Hawaii charged them twice the cost of Arnott Gen II bags to put on springs. (Anyone want to buy some NEW springs?)
I just got the valve body rebuild kits from Becm Dr Scott, and will be putting the air bags and all back where they belong on wife's, so I can drive mine all the time.
These trucks really were superbly designed and well thought out with regards to the suspension, and springs are just an abomination!
Now, before anyone tears me apart, I am a purist here, and folks who like springs are entitled to their perfectly valid opinion as to the simplicity of them.
I just prefer the EAS in it's fully functional form, and am willing to suffer the trip home on the stops when things go wrong! (Got a Nano in the cubby now)
As was stated above, trying to shed weight on a P-38? why bother, it will ,make you crazy, and in the end, will make no difference.
Cheers
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Well, I was told shedding some lbs will help with the MPG since the added weight of the 20' rims hurt the MPG
Bigger rims can adversely affect your mpg because of the rotating mass.
Removing 50 pounds of stationary dead weight is not going to affect your mpg to any noticeable degree.



Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App
02 Range Rover Westminster
98 Discovery LE Tdi
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Pople here suggesting to keep and switch back to EAS, telling you simple truth. Im driving defender on day basis (brand new double cab), and I kiss my p38 old butt every time I sit in it. Difference is outstanding, and literally impossible to compare. I say this because I guess p38 on coils is something like luxury defender, and why would you do that to such gorgeous truck?
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

No-one likes springs. Name *one* car that handles and rides well on springs.
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

No-one likes springs. Name *one* car that handles and rides well on springs.
A Range Rover Classic :)
And then Land Rover took it to the next level...
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Just to add another truth regarding mpg. When riding on airsprings the car lower itselfs above 55, if anything saves fuel, that is one major thing. You cant get that on coils, it`s mostly the other way around when riding coils, their almost always lifted an inch or two, making fuel economy even worse in highway speed.
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

making fuel economy even worse in highway speed.
To say nothing of stability if you have to brake and swerve sharply at speed. One of the reasons they started putting the Classic onto air was for this reason. As they got more luxurious, people were buying them instead of an S class Merc or similar but expecting to drive them the same. One or two were rolled so they did something about it.

In terms of cost, in the UK a mid range spring conversion kit will cost you £300-350 but air springs are £70 a corner. So keeping it as it was intended is actually cheaper than butchering it.
 

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JACK'S GRANDAD
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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Well, I was told shedding some lbs will help with the MPG since the added weight of the 20' rims hurt the MPG
And who gave you this sage advise? Removing a small air tank, and a few other small bits and pieces will do absolutely nothing to improve your MPG. Now dumping the pimp wheels and going back to a stock size would have more effect than anything else. Unless of course the 20's are a super light wheel and tire combination, that is the exact same diameter as the stock tires? Doubting it though.....

Martin
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

No-one likes springs. Name *one* car that handles and rides well on springs.
Really? An airbag is not a spring then? Wow, guess I have had it wrong all these years......
There are more "cars" that ride excellent on coil springs than what could be typed here.
If you have not experienced any, I suggest driving something from the 1980's and onwards sometime.

Martin
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Okay, I meant specifically coil springs - and they're a hideous compromise at best. It's impossible to make a car that handles well and has an acceptable ride with them. They're hopeless.
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

I think the main point here is that a P-38 was designed and constructed to use an EAS for ride, comfort, stability and yes, even better fuel economy at speed.
As such, doing a conversion to coils drastically changes all of the above characteristics, and none for the better.
Of course there are some super fine rides on coils, or torsion bars, but they were designed for them.
Not many of you would have had an opportunity to drive one, but for sheer off road comfort as far as ride on REALLY nasty stuff. Try an Austin Champ!
Of course, the comfort stops with the ride, but the suspension really soaks up all the bumps!
Compare to an type 1 or 2 Landie and the difference is like an P-38 on air and a P-38 on coils.
Just ordered the bags for the 2000.....Gonna get rid of the bed springs1
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

If you want to improve the fuel economy, put the air suspension back on (far lighter than those stupid bedsprings) and fit the proper tyres.

As RRToadHall says, just about nothing short of having a lighter right foot will improve the fuel economy of these cars. They're heavy and they're as aerodynamic as a garden shed. That said, on petrol I can get around 24mpg according to the trip computer, which ties in approximately with what it takes in fuel.

The coil springs are expensive. Your insurance will now be expensive. Your Range Rover will handle badly, have a harsh ride and have its headlights pointing anywhere but where you need them to be. Those springs were a waste of money. A coil spring kit over here - a cheap one, at that - is around £250 which translates to about 200l of petrol or nearly 400l of gas! Petrol prices in the US are cheaper and Rangie bits are more expensive, so you'll see even more petrol for the cost of those springs.

How much of a difference do you expect taking a couple of kilos off a 2.5 tonne vehicle will make?
Paid $0 for the Coil Springs, Have a light foot still only get about 9 MPG city, My insurance is $43 a month full coverage regardless if it is springs or airbags, the handling is great. Headlights point just fine and can see more than my old car. If I had the cash I would go back to EAS. I got the car for a whopping $200. Yes, I am attempting to find the right wheels for the p38. All I want to do is get the gas up to what it should be. I do not care nor want your opinion on springs, nor did I ask for it
 

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Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Okay, I meant specifically coil springs - and they're a hideous compromise at best. It's impossible to make a car that handles well and has an acceptable ride with them. They're hopeless.
Hmmm OK then. I own, have owned, and will continue to buy, vehicles on coil springs.
I have had Old Man Emu leaf springs that ride excellent, never mind coils, which are better yet.
Blanket statements like that do nothing as far as actual knowledge goes I'm afraid...

Martin
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Oh yea,
As long as we are gonna be beating up on you.......
I bought an 2000 with springs and 20 inch bling wheels (It was a good deal, and the wife liked it)
The ride was so harsh I refused to drive it!
The wife really preferred mine and would take it into town instead of hers! (16 in steel wheels and slightly over sized tires) Great ride on air!
I recently picked up a mint untitled parts 00 with stock 16 in wheels and fitted them to her car with new stock sized tires.
Better, but according to herself, not good enuf! (Got mine back 'tho)
The other reason for getting the 00 was that aside from bags, the air system is fully functional. the PO destroyed each bag in turn by jacking the body up to do brakes.
An unethical inde here in Hawaii charged them twice the cost of Arnott Gen II bags to put on springs. (Anyone want to buy some NEW springs?)
I just got the valve body rebuild kits from Becm Dr Scott, and will be putting the air bags and all back where they belong on wife's, so I can drive mine all the time.
These trucks really were superbly designed and well thought out with regards to the suspension, and springs are just an abomination!
Now, before anyone tears me apart, I am a purist here, and folks who like springs are entitled to their perfectly valid opinion as to the simplicity of them.
I just prefer the EAS in it's fully functional form, and am willing to suffer the trip home on the stops when things go wrong! (Got a Nano in the cubby now)
As was stated above, trying to shed weight on a P-38? why bother, it will ,make you crazy, and in the end, will make no difference.
Cheers
As I said before I would gladly return to EAS but I cannot afford to purchase new airbags and any other thing this p38 may be missing. I Am literally a broke College Student. I literally have $5 to my name and a full tank of gas. I do not have a job currently, I am looking but have been unable to find someone who will work with my college schedule. That being said I understand airbags have issues that are USUALLY a cheap fix, whereas springs don't usually have anything go wrong with them except a bad strut/shock. I do NOT go 4x4 and if I could find a way to make the rover 2 wheel drive I would. I drive in the city, city and a rock road here and there but that is it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Re: P38 Converted to Spring What is Ok to remove to drop some lbs

Hmmm OK then. I own, have owned, and will continue to buy, vehicles on coil springs.
I have had Old Man Emu leaf springs that ride excellent, never mind coils, which are better yet.
Blanket statements like that do nothing as far as actual knowledge goes I'm afraid...

Martin
My p38 Rides great we have these huge speed bumps in town around the round-abouts and it handles great over them and it has coils!
 
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