RangeRovers.net Forum banner

1 - 20 of 24 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Good afternoon to everyone on this forum. I'm new to the forum, and I am looking for any information someone may be able to lend.

Backstory: Years ago, had a P38 02 4.6 HSE. Thoroughly enjoyed that truck. About a week ago, I got the bug again and decided to purchase another Rover. I purchased a 2012 Autobiography Edition (69.3k miles) on 4 Sept, from a dealership that claimed to have already sent to truck to a LR certified mechanic and had the following work done:
1. Replaced Timing Chain
2. Replaced Timing Chain Guides
3. Replaced Pulleys and Tensioners
4. Replaced Catalytic Converter

They sent me paperwork, showing where all of this was completed to the tune of nearly $7k. This was bit of information that helped me decide to purchase the vehicle out-of-state and have it shipped to me. I received the rig on 4 Sept, and drove it for 3 days, until the following happened:
1. CEL came on. Immediately, from previous RR experience, I checked out the fuel cap. And, of course, it was in need of replacement. Besides the gasket not being in good shape, when turned to click/lock position, it would turn back and unlock after about 10 secs. So, I ordered a new one.
2. A couple days later, while on the interstate going to a store and between exits, I gave a little gas to pass another vehicle and all the power dropped. Suddenly, the "Restricted Performance" yellow triangle popped up. I eased off the gas and made it the quarter mile to the store. When I came back out, I started the RR up and the light was gone. I pulled out and headed home.
3. Upon returning home I noticed that when I pulled into the carport and stopped, the RR started idling very roughly. Then, the battery light flashed on. I shut the rig off and started it again, to see what would happen. It started, but then began idling very roughly again. Oddly enough, I once had an issue with my P38, where I started it up and the dash lit up like a Christmas Tree. After a lot of searching and taking it to LR mechanics, one of them decided to check and replace my battery. Once he did, I never had another issue. The battery had enough amps to crank the truck, but couldn't sustain the electrical pull, even with a functioning alternator. The truck went bananas. Remembering this, made me take a look at the battery and check it out. It was dated 2014, which makes it over 5 yrs old, but I was getting about 13.8amps out of it. I'm still waiting for the new fuel cap, also.
4. Decided to drive it to a certified LR mechanic last night. Started it up, it began idling roughly. I put the truck in reverse, and when I gave it gas to back out of the carport, it died. Started it again, put it in reverse, pressed gas and it cut off. I was able to start it and put it back into Drive and pull it back into the carport. I then called a flatbed tow truck.
5. When the flatbed arrived, to make it easier to load, I started it again and tried to back out of the carport. I was able to do so, though it was touch going.

(Sorry for the long story. But, I'm trying to give as much detail as possible. Fast forward to today)

The shop called and I went to check things out. Once they put it on the computer, it pulled the following codes:
P0302
P0304
P0306
P0308
P0157
P2098
P0506

I have no clue what the heck is going on with this truck. The mechanic said he could also smell gas, though he did not see any leaks anywhere. The truck is not running hot...A/C blowing ice cold (it's 100+ degrees in AL right now). For 3 to 4 days, the truck ran awesomely....had very strong power on the interstate...no issues at all. Oh, and to add one thing...about 2 days ago I stopped and filled up at a local gas station (93 Octane). This was the second time I'd filled up. The first time was on the AFB, where I work. The second was large gas station, off base. Don't know if that makes any difference. I'm really stressing out right now. I've paid a decent price for this truck. And now, it's sitting and I can't even drive it. And, I haven't even made the first payment on it. Everyone have a great evening...look forward to some clarification, if anyone can assist.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
180 Posts
Good afternoon to everyone on this forum. I'm new to the forum, and I am looking for any information someone may be able to lend.

Backstory: Years ago, had a P38 02 4.6 HSE. Thoroughly enjoyed that truck. About a week ago, I got the bug again and decided to purchase another Rover. I purchased a 2012 Autobiography Edition (69.3k miles) on 4 Sept, from a dealership that claimed to have already sent to truck to a LR certified mechanic and had the following work done:
1. Replaced Timing Chain
2. Replaced Timing Chain Guides
3. Replaced Pulleys and Tensioners
4. Replaced Catalytic Converter

They sent me paperwork, showing where all of this was completed to the tune of nearly $7k. This was bit of information that helped me decide to purchase the vehicle out-of-state and have it shipped to me. I received the rig on 4 Sept, and drove it for 3 days, until the following happened:
1. CEL came on. Immediately, from previous RR experience, I checked out the fuel cap. And, of course, it was in need of replacement. Besides the gasket not being in good shape, when turned to click/lock position, it would turn back and unlock after about 10 secs. So, I ordered a new one.
2. A couple days later, while on the interstate going to a store and between exits, I gave a little gas to pass another vehicle and all the power dropped. Suddenly, the "Restricted Performance" yellow triangle popped up. I eased off the gas and made it the quarter mile to the store. When I came back out, I started the RR up and the light was gone. I pulled out and headed home.
3. Upon returning home I noticed that when I pulled into the carport and stopped, the RR started idling very roughly. Then, the battery light flashed on. I shut the rig off and started it again, to see what would happen. It started, but then began idling very roughly again. Oddly enough, I once had an issue with my P38, where I started it up and the dash lit up like a Christmas Tree. After a lot of searching and taking it to LR mechanics, one of them decided to check and replace my battery. Once he did, I never had another issue. The battery had enough amps to crank the truck, but couldn't sustain the electrical pull, even with a functioning alternator. The truck went bananas. Remembering this, made me take a look at the battery and check it out. It was dated 2014, which makes it over 5 yrs old, but I was getting about 13.8amps out of it. I'm still waiting for the new fuel cap, also.
4. Decided to drive it to a certified LR mechanic last night. Started it up, it began idling roughly. I put the truck in reverse, and when I gave it gas to back out of the carport, it died. Started it again, put it in reverse, pressed gas and it cut off. I was able to start it and put it back into Drive and pull it back into the carport. I then called a flatbed tow truck.
5. When the flatbed arrived, to make it easier to load, I started it again and tried to back out of the carport. I was able to do so, though it was touch going.

(Sorry for the long story. But, I'm trying to give as much detail as possible. Fast forward to today)

The shop called and I went to check things out. Once they put it on the computer, it pulled the following codes:
P0302
P0304
P0306
P0308
P0157
P2098
P0506

I have no clue what the heck is going on with this truck. The mechanic said he could also smell gas, though he did not see any leaks anywhere. The truck is not running hot...A/C blowing ice cold (it's 100+ degrees in AL right now). For 3 to 4 days, the truck ran awesomely....had very strong power on the interstate...no issues at all. Oh, and to add one thing...about 2 days ago I stopped and filled up at a local gas station (93 Octane). This was the second time I'd filled up. The first time was on the AFB, where I work. The second was large gas station, off base. Don't know if that makes any difference. I'm really stressing out right now. I've paid a decent price for this truck. And now, it's sitting and I can't even drive it. And, I haven't even made the first payment on it. Everyone have a great evening...look forward to some clarification, if anyone can assist.
P0302 Cylinder 2 Misfire Detected
P0304 Cylinder 4 Misfire Detected
P0306 Cylinder 6 Misfire Detected
P0308 Cylinder 8 Misfire Detected
P0157 O2 Sensor Circuit Low B2S2
P2098 Post Catalyst Fuel Trim System Too Lean Bank 2
P0506 Idle Air Control System RPM Lower Than Expected

Okay so let’s first fix that valve cover gasket your guy ****ed up... then clear the codes and we’ll see if any of them crop back up again.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,090 Posts
Okay so let’s first fix that valve cover gasket your guy ****ed up... then clear the codes and we’ll see if any of them crop back up again.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
you may as well start explaining yourself
if anything injector seals could have been messed up, but no way all four are messed up


it kind of sounds like the dealer tech messed up timing that passenger side bank, and after the phaser messed with timing (full throttle) it went out of wack

but that is odd as it would through a timing code

bring it back to the dealer that did the work and have THEM test it, being they had the engine torn apart..

I feel like it would be like a fuel pressure sensor, they fail around that time.....

The battery could also be bad causing some systems to malfunction, just because it has proper voltage doesn't mean it's a good battery. It should be load tested. Autozone or similar can do that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
So, taking the RR back to the shop that performed the timing chain work, is pretty much a slim chance for me...considering I live about 600+ miles away from it. I bought the truck from a dealership and had it shipped to me.

Another question I have is this....could a faulty and/or dirty MAF sensor be a potential cause for this? The misfiring, running lean and power loss at acceleration? I was told by another mechanic that I know, that this has caused similar issues to other vehicles before. I'm just trying to think of all the potential simple causes, before going into "tear engine down" mode. Sometimes, the simplest answer is often the correct one. Right now, I'm leaning towards replacing the 5yr old battery, installing the new fuel cap and having the MAF sensor checked/cleaned. Or, if it turns out to be faulty, having it replaced. Then, seeing where I am with this issue after that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
I think if it was timing it wouldn't have ever driven right but as so much of the engine has been apart it could be an issue with seals, air or fuel supply.

It is worth checking both MAFs and both air filters and also all the air hoses as it's an entire bank that seems to be having issues. If it's not on the air side it could well be a fuel supply issue.

It could of course also be badly seated or bad injectors.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
I have the RR at the shop, replacing the battery and having the 2 MAF sensors cleaned. I should have the new fuel cap, over the weekend. I plan to go on Monday and replace the cap. Then, we'll see where I am with the truck.

Now, understand that I'm no auto tech expert....not even a novice. In fact, consider me an auto tech embryo. My tech skills have yet to be born. But, I've had enough vehicles that I've found trying the simplest solutions can sometimes save you thousands of dollars. So, we'll see how this goes! :unsure::LOL:

The mechanic did mention that a local dealer that specializes in LR's, asked about my RR, when he saw it in the shop this morning. He said that he had a similar issue with an '11 RR HSE about 4 months ago. That one ended up needing a new ECU. He had to have it towed to the nearest LR dealership (80 miles away) and they replaced the ECU. He said it was $1200 for them to replace it. So, I guess I'll keep that in mind.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,090 Posts
Probably not going to be an ECU or MAF.

These 5.0s are iffy on timing, they'll run and throw codes, or they'll run poorly with no codes. I've gone ahead and decided for the 2 timing jobs I've done to simply do the guides and tensioners without ever having to take off the valve covers (and thus injectors) or needing to re-time the engine. My indy shop told me that the timing is so hard on the tools they replace the timing tools every 3-4 jobs.

Replace the battery first..
If your mechanic as a Snapon tool it can go to Live data and look at the passenger side (bank 2) fuel pressure sensor and fuel temp sensor, tell him to make sure that side high pressure fuel pump is not failing.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
229 Posts
It sounds like one of the two high pressure fuel pumps is beginning to fail.

Normal low pressure (indirect) fuel injection systems are typically less than 100psi demand.

However, the direct fuel injection systems on the 5.0 motors require much higher delivery pressures and thus the two HP pumps are plumbed to work "in series" to produce fuel delivery pressures up to 2000psi.

Unfortunately, it's a trial and error effort to identify which of the two co-located pumps is failing as they feed a common T-shaped fuel fitting at the front of the right bank.

You can try replacing the "front" pump first and road test to check the results but frankly, with the risk of doubling the labor charge when changing the pumps separately (and it's definitely not a five minute job) typically it's better to replace both high pressure pumps at the same time.

Rob
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Out of interest what's the fuel cap issue - I've not heard about that one?
An old, decayed fuel cap will cause a pressure differential int he fuel system and could cause a rough running engine and fault codes.

I am having a similar issue to the OP with my 2011 5.0 SC that I just had a head job done on. It ran great for week after the rebuild then BAM restricted performance and misfires on 1357. We are thinking electrical not mechanical at this point.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
An old, decayed fuel cap will cause a pressure differential int he fuel system and could cause a rough running engine and fault codes.

I am having a similar issue to the OP with my 2011 5.0 SC that I just had a head job done on. It ran great for week after the rebuild then BAM restricted performance and misfires on 1357. We are thinking electrical not mechanical at this point.
Yes, I'm not sure if people realize what kinds of issues a bad fuel cap can cause. If the gasket is bad, or the locking mechanism...like mine...it can throw off the fuel pressure sensor as well as the vacuum pressure. My cap unlocks, after you put it on. It clicks once, but then after about 10 secs, it clicks back to unlock. My new one should be in today. I had a similar issue on my P38 some years back. It threw all types of codes, as well as made the truck run horribly, until I replaced it with a new one.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Never buy a used RR out of state. And if you happen to do, always buy it from a Range Rover authorize dealer. And always always purchase the extended warranty. No, and, buts, or ifs. Period!

In your case. i would Pay the $800 to ship the car back and either get my money back or have them repair all issue at their own cost. Speak to upper management and if they do not what to help you out, contact an Attorney. Good luck with this issue man.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6 Posts
Good afternoon to everyone on this forum. I'm new to the forum, and I am looking for any information someone may be able to lend.

Backstory: Years ago, had a P38 02 4.6 HSE. Thoroughly enjoyed that truck. About a week ago, I got the bug again and decided to purchase another Rover. I purchased a 2012 Autobiography Edition (69.3k miles) on 4 Sept, from a dealership that claimed to have already sent to truck to a LR certified mechanic and had the following work done:
1. Replaced Timing Chain
2. Replaced Timing Chain Guides
3. Replaced Pulleys and Tensioners
4. Replaced Catalytic Converter

They sent me paperwork, showing where all of this was completed to the tune of nearly $7k. This was bit of information that helped me decide to purchase the vehicle out-of-state and have it shipped to me. I received the rig on 4 Sept, and drove it for 3 days, until the following happened:
1. CEL came on. Immediately, from previous RR experience, I checked out the fuel cap. And, of course, it was in need of replacement. Besides the gasket not being in good shape, when turned to click/lock position, it would turn back and unlock after about 10 secs. So, I ordered a new one.
2. A couple days later, while on the interstate going to a store and between exits, I gave a little gas to pass another vehicle and all the power dropped. Suddenly, the "Restricted Performance" yellow triangle popped up. I eased off the gas and made it the quarter mile to the store. When I came back out, I started the RR up and the light was gone. I pulled out and headed home.
3. Upon returning home I noticed that when I pulled into the carport and stopped, the RR started idling very roughly. Then, the battery light flashed on. I shut the rig off and started it again, to see what would happen. It started, but then began idling very roughly again. Oddly enough, I once had an issue with my P38, where I started it up and the dash lit up like a Christmas Tree. After a lot of searching and taking it to LR mechanics, one of them decided to check and replace my battery. Once he did, I never had another issue. The battery had enough amps to crank the truck, but couldn't sustain the electrical pull, even with a functioning alternator. The truck went bananas. Remembering this, made me take a look at the battery and check it out. It was dated 2014, which makes it over 5 yrs old, but I was getting about 13.8amps out of it. I'm still waiting for the new fuel cap, also.
4. Decided to drive it to a certified LR mechanic last night. Started it up, it began idling roughly. I put the truck in reverse, and when I gave it gas to back out of the carport, it died. Started it again, put it in reverse, pressed gas and it cut off. I was able to start it and put it back into Drive and pull it back into the carport. I then called a flatbed tow truck.
5. When the flatbed arrived, to make it easier to load, I started it again and tried to back out of the carport. I was able to do so, though it was touch going.

(Sorry for the long story. But, I'm trying to give as much detail as possible. Fast forward to today)

The shop called and I went to check things out. Once they put it on the computer, it pulled the following codes:
P0302
P0304
P0306
P0308
P0157
P2098
P0506

I have no clue what the heck is going on with this truck. The mechanic said he could also smell gas, though he did not see any leaks anywhere. The truck is not running hot...A/C blowing ice cold (it's 100+ degrees in AL right now). For 3 to 4 days, the truck ran awesomely....had very strong power on the interstate...no issues at all. Oh, and to add one thing...about 2 days ago I stopped and filled up at a local gas station (93 Octane). This was the second time I'd filled up. The first time was on the AFB, where I work. The second was large gas station, off base. Don't know if that makes any difference. I'm really stressing out right now. I've paid a decent price for this truck. And now, it's sitting and I can't even drive it. And, I haven't even made the first payment on it. Everyone have a great evening...look forward to some clarification, if anyone can assist.
Good afternoon to everyone on this forum. I'm new to the forum, and I am looking for any information someone may be able to lend.

Backstory: Years ago, had a P38 02 4.6 HSE. Thoroughly enjoyed that truck. About a week ago, I got the bug again and decided to purchase another Rover. I purchased a 2012 Autobiography Edition (69.3k miles) on 4 Sept, from a dealership that claimed to have already sent to truck to a LR certified mechanic and had the following work done:
1. Replaced Timing Chain
2. Replaced Timing Chain Guides
3. Replaced Pulleys and Tensioners
4. Replaced Catalytic Converter

They sent me paperwork, showing where all of this was completed to the tune of nearly $7k. This was bit of information that helped me decide to purchase the vehicle out-of-state and have it shipped to me. I received the rig on 4 Sept, and drove it for 3 days, until the following happened:
1. CEL came on. Immediately, from previous RR experience, I checked out the fuel cap. And, of course, it was in need of replacement. Besides the gasket not being in good shape, when turned to click/lock position, it would turn back and unlock after about 10 secs. So, I ordered a new one.
2. A couple days later, while on the interstate going to a store and between exits, I gave a little gas to pass another vehicle and all the power dropped. Suddenly, the "Restricted Performance" yellow triangle popped up. I eased off the gas and made it the quarter mile to the store. When I came back out, I started the RR up and the light was gone. I pulled out and headed home.
3. Upon returning home I noticed that when I pulled into the carport and stopped, the RR started idling very roughly. Then, the battery light flashed on. I shut the rig off and started it again, to see what would happen. It started, but then began idling very roughly again. Oddly enough, I once had an issue with my P38, where I started it up and the dash lit up like a Christmas Tree. After a lot of searching and taking it to LR mechanics, one of them decided to check and replace my battery. Once he did, I never had another issue. The battery had enough amps to crank the truck, but couldn't sustain the electrical pull, even with a functioning alternator. The truck went bananas. Remembering this, made me take a look at the battery and check it out. It was dated 2014, which makes it over 5 yrs old, but I was getting about 13.8amps out of it. I'm still waiting for the new fuel cap, also.
4. Decided to drive it to a certified LR mechanic last night. Started it up, it began idling roughly. I put the truck in reverse, and when I gave it gas to back out of the carport, it died. Started it again, put it in reverse, pressed gas and it cut off. I was able to start it and put it back into Drive and pull it back into the carport. I then called a flatbed tow truck.
5. When the flatbed arrived, to make it easier to load, I started it again and tried to back out of the carport. I was able to do so, though it was touch going.

(Sorry for the long story. But, I'm trying to give as much detail as possible. Fast forward to today)

The shop called and I went to check things out. Once they put it on the computer, it pulled the following codes:
P0302
P0304
P0306
P0308
P0157
P2098
P0506

I have no clue what the heck is going on with this truck. The mechanic said he could also smell gas, though he did not see any leaks anywhere. The truck is not running hot...A/C blowing ice cold (it's 100+ degrees in AL right now). For 3 to 4 days, the truck ran awesomely....had very strong power on the interstate...no issues at all. Oh, and to add one thing...about 2 days ago I stopped and filled up at a local gas station (93 Octane). This was the second time I'd filled up. The first time was on the AFB, where I work. The second was large gas station, off base. Don't know if that makes any difference. I'm really stressing out right now. I've paid a decent price for this truck. And now, it's sitting and I can't even drive it. And, I haven't even made the first payment on it. Everyone have a great evening...look forward to some clarification, if anyone can assist.
Sounds like a combustion problem due to lack of fuel or electric spark delivery. However, your battery is old. Any battery over 3 yrs old is suspect. I would change that out first since it has due anyway.

If the problem persists, change out the coil packs and spark plugs. Coil packs are expensive for the L322 so I would just change out only the cylinder that the trouble code is specifying and see if that fixes the problem.

Good luck.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
I just talked to my mechanic who did the top end work on my L322. He had taken it to my regular mechanic, who found a loose ground strap from the block to frame. It was causing ECU to go haywire and send all sorts of misfire codes. Before you start throwing parts at it, double and triple check your grounding.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,345 Posts
So all four cylinders on Bank #2 (US driver's side) are misfiring...
Funny thing I recently learned on these 2012's and similar is that there's this nifty system called the Intake Manifold Tuning Valve, actually one for each bank.
Each one modulates airflow in it's respective fuel runner in the intake manifold.
It can interfere with the airflow into the cylinders of that bank if it's got a problem.
Just something to consider.
The IMTVs are on the rear of the intake manifold.

I had sort of a similar driving experience last week, and so far in addition to a code for an IMTV failure, only get a code for cylinder #6 misfiring.
I took it to the dealership - they went off on an odd tangent saying that cylinder #6 is misfiring due to a blown head gasket leaking coolant in there. That's odd since I'm not losing coolant, not smelling coolant, not losing pressure in my coolant system when it sits and cools, no steam out of the exhaust...
But anyway, when I ask them "what about the P0660 IMTV code that I brought it in here for you guys to look at?" they just say they haven't gone past the blown head gasket", and want to completely rebuild the top-end including timing drive train.
.. So I'm taking it to a reputable indy mechanic tomorrow that is also puzzled by their analysis. We'll see...
But I digress - enough about my 2012.
Considering that each of these 2 Intake Manifold Tuning Valves control airflow for a whole bank of cylinders, although you're not getting a specific fault for that, it may also be worth considering along with other bank-2 (cylinders 2-4-6-8) specific possibilities.
I'd imagine not many things will affect an entire bank, and only one bank.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,345 Posts
Sounds like a combustion problem due to lack of fuel or electric spark delivery.
Keep in mind that airflow is part of the fuel. Gasoline is only part of it.

If the problem persists, change out the coil packs and spark plugs. Coil packs are expensive...
Good point, and since coils aren't cheap, but easy to remove/install, I'd first just swap coils between the cylinders that are fine, and the ones that are misfiring. If the problem follows the coils, then the coils (are) bad. If the same cylinders still mis-fire, it wasn't the coil.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,345 Posts
A coincidence - I was just browsing the Jaguar forum and look what I found (same Jag 5.0L engine)...

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
201 Posts
Leaking injector rail can do this and in some severe cases can even hydro lock the engine due to way too much gasoline dripping into combustion chamber. Happened commonly to early to N62 V8s found in 745s until new injectors were released by the factory.
 

·
JACK'S GRANDAD
Joined
·
9,119 Posts
Geez....Lots of guesses here.
I just installed a "rebuilt" 5.0 into a '10 LR4.
Multiple misfires on Bank 2 right off the bat.
Switched sensors etc, same result.
The exhaust cam phaser was screwed. Replaced it, retimed, runs perfectly.
Look at the live data for the exhaust cams. They should be pretty much in line.
Here is the data I got before swapping the exhaust cam phaser on bank 2. After they were both the same within 2 degree's
. Either the sensor went South, or the timing. Either way, they need to look at the live data to determine the problem. Guessing is expensive....
cam timing.jpg
 

·
JACK'S GRANDAD
Joined
·
9,119 Posts
Where are you located at??
 
1 - 20 of 24 Posts
Top