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Discussion Starter #1
Hello all. I'm new to the forum here and kinda new at Range Rover diagnosis.
I've had it for a while and been through alot of it, but I'm not too sure what's going on with the transmission now.
I had it rebuilt a couple years ago (for about as much as I paid for the Rover). :roll:
It had lost reverse, but had no problems with any other gears.
After the warranty ran out on the rebuild, it started losing reverse again randomly.
I could pull it forward a bit and get it into reverse eventually and after doing this for a couple months it started working good again.
Which brings me to today.
After dropping off my little work trailer at a job site, I pulled out to the street to park it and when I put it in reverse... nothing... so I put it in drive to do the pull forward thing and it starts slipping and then nothing.
I start going through the gears and the dif lock, but still nothing except for the whining/grinding sound in Park and Neutral (both of them work). :dance:
I could get it to creep about 10 feet in reverse if I didn't give it any gas, but it would eventually give up.
The noises seem to be loudest around the transmissions fluid pan.

So my question is... should I set fire to it or blow it up with explosives?

Just kidding. I love the old rust bucket.
I just can't see spending the kind of money that transmission "specialists" ask for... AGAIN! :doh:
I would like to do it myself, but I don't know where to begin.
I thought about getting an OEM certified tranny and having a friend slap it in for a $100 or so, but I would almost feel better doing it myself.

Are there any threads that explain this stuff in detail?
Is it something that might not mean replacing the trans?
Any suggestions will be appreciated.
 

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2010-2012 Range Rover MkIII / L322
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Have you drained the fluid to see what condition it is in, before the whole gearbox is written off?
 

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Hi there.

I tend to try looking on the bright side and try the easy/ cheaper fixes first. Rather than the gearbox itself, is there something failing in terms of the selector? ie not making your gear 'mode' selection properly? (assuming it an auto from the description). I not had this fault, so I'm only guessing this is controlled by relays etc??... I have experience of RR relays, plenty of them and several of mine have failed in the past.

Check fluid level ie car running in neutral when you lift the autobox dipstick out. (make sure the ATF oil is still a nice red colour after box rebuild...someone using even a small amount of motor oil or moly oil in the autobox will be disastrous)
Check what the transfer box is doing. hi or lo range properly selected?


just a couple of my initial thoughts. I know how frustrationg these things can be. hope you can find the fault
 

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hi those are the same transmission used on BMW. Volvo jaguar. next time just find one low mileage Volvo and pull the transmission out, don't pay 4 rebuild .it will never be the same

the other thing is on those transmissions when reverse goes out is the sign that its over,
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Ok so I dug into it a little.
I checked the dipstick level first, which was ok as well as the color. The Hi Lo and linkage seem to be fine...
I removed the exhaust and the cross member and drained it. The color didn't look as good from the bottom side. It was a little dirty and dark.
I removed the pan which had some shavings and dark dusty sediment in the bottom. :think:
I removed the filter which was covered in the dark dusty substance and it had some shavings inside.

I stopped there, replaced the filter and pan while I gather more information and speak to an old friend that does transmissions.

Is there a way to check relays and other stuff without pulling the transmission out.
I could see some wiring up around it, but couldn't really tell where there was a relay or anything.


Oh and it's a 4 speed automatic in a 89' classic. Forgot to mention that.
 

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Hangover.

C.J. is right on the button by stating your tranny is shot, considering reverse is not selecting & this ZF "puffmatic" has already been rebuild once before-move on.
Your Four speed will never overheat from my personal experiences with German design, but unfortunately when a mechanical component lets go you need another.

If your Rangie has the gear driven LT230 transfer case(typical whine versus the V/C units) than I'd suggest if you want to keep her, transplant the engine as well ?
Attached is this listing I saw on Ebay recently for sale in Michigan or Ohio I believe, should fit into the engine bay of our beasts and already comes with a tranny.

Cheerio,


Vinniman
'88 Highline
Perth, W.A.[attachment=0:2113xn1j]DodgeV10.jpg[/attachment:2113xn1j]
 

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HangRover, you write that you have the sound of grinding in forward or reverse in both Hi and Low ranges? And Neutral and Park work fine? I had a failure two years ago that sounded almost exactly like your symptoms. We were saving up to replace the transfer case when we got a confirmation diagnosis from Dave Ashcroft at http://ashcroft-transmissions.co.uk/ that the output shaft splines had sheared in the transfer case. The shaft was only about $120 plus two-day shipping from England. The repair was only about four hours long, and we were back on the road again. Contact Dave Ashcroft via e-mail to see if he can offer any advice. He's a busy fellow, so his e-mails are terse, but his experience is priceless.

Scott
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Hey.
Just wanted to say thanks for the responses. Dave Ashcroft helped a bunch. He asked some very specific questions and gave me a very definate answer... SHOT!... just like some of you told me.

Well, I ended up swapping it with one from a 88' County that some friends and I have been robbing parts off of for some time. Best 500 bucks we ever spent!
It's lower geared than my spent one, but I think that might be better for how I use it anyway.
It took a little finagling when it came to the E-brake, but other than that it was pretty painless. Had to switch out the console to allow for the difference in the Hi-Lo shifters, but that was an upgrade compared to what I had to begin with.

Still truckin' for a while now...
so thanks again.

Dave
 

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What a releaf to get that job done ! I did a transfer case last winter, the reason I mentioned the heaviest job last post , but it is nice to be running again , so congrats . It doesnt hurt to change the oil soon just to make sure you're all clean inside , also I like lucas trans fix additive in older cars.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
classicjack said:
also I like lucas trans fix additive in older cars.
I actually have a bottle of that for when I do change it.
I have been putting it off because my exhaust is all one piece and would have to cut and piece it together with the parts rover's... and I'm kinda lazy.
I've probably driven it way to much already, but I cleaned all the lines out pretty well before the swap and the fluid that was in the transplant looked brand new. The magnet on the drain plug had almost no shavings on it too, so I feel ok about it.
I'll dig in to it again when it warms up a little. Hopefully it will still look clean.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Well, I guess I jinxed myself by saying I was still truckin. I'm having problems again.
When it was really cold outside, it started making a buzzing noise and would shift a little slow before it got warmed up. When it did get warmed up it acted fine and no abnormal noises. I thought, Ok... probably the filter, because I read something about that on Ashcroft's site.
Seeing as how it would go away after warming up, I thought I would see how it did when the weather warmed up... I haven't been driving much anyway.
So the weather warms up and it seems to warm up quicker, but the noise is a little louder. Sounds like a small coffee grinder now, but it goes away. No more noticable problems until I drove about 40 miles to go fishing with my Dad. After fishing I get in and start it up and the sound doesn't go away and may be a little louder.
Hmmm... middle of nowhere... not much I can do... guess I'll drive back and see what happens. I stopped and gassed up and when I started it back up... no noises! Ok... don't feel so bad... drop Dad off and hit the highway. Now I'm not rodding it or anything, but I give it some gas to pass a car and it kinda slips like it wanted to downshift for a second and goes back into high gear. I took it even easier after that and got to a stop light. The noise is back... it does the slip thing again in 2nd and again in 3rd.
So the next day I decide to take it back to Dad's and park it and borrow one of his Rovers. It does the slip thing a few times on the way, always when under load. The noise is constant and happens in every gear selection, lessening a little while changing from one to the next. The noise seems to be coming from the bell housing.

Any ideas? I have been trying to find troubleshooting info on the torque converter.
Ashcroft said it sounded more like a govenor symptom than a converter, but the governor troubleshooting info I have read seems to have different symptoms.

I can't even find out where the govenor is exactly.

Any input or links will be appreciated... as usual.
 

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Are you sure it's slipping in 2nd and 3rd gears? The lock-up torque converter's clutch engages in 2nd, 3rd, and 4th. Putting your foot into it may simply be triggering the transmission to release the torque converter clutch to gain some torque multiplication. That may account for an extra 100-500 rpm "flare" when you give it gas. If you've got more than that without gaining any speed then you may have some slipping.

So let's think about what might be happening if your transmission really is slipping.... The ZF 4HP22 is completely hydraulic, so it is very sensitive to pump pressures. The single best known cause of low pump pressures that increase wear on the internal band clutches is a clogged filter and burnt transmission fluid. The valve body is above the transmission's sump, on the underside of the transmission. You'll see if when you pull the pan off to change the fluid and filter.

Scott
 

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Discussion Starter #16
It's not necessarily sliping. It acts like it's going to downshift for a split second, but never does. Kinda jumping out of gear and back in.
I had been taking it easy on it too. Trying not to give it gas so it wouldn't do it.
 

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It's hard to understand what you did to repair problem . Did you use an old torque converter from blown trans ? Its a good idea to flush these out to remove any grindings from blown trans or bad oil from used converter will flow into new trans and you'll have same problem again.also cooler needs flushed out. A new converter is always a good idea, also its good to know the history of donor car . I've also had the output shaft spline problem, but this makes car immobile. It sounds like another bad trans .
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I don't know the history on the parts Rover, but it was running when it was relocated. It had some brand new parts on it, like the gas tank I swapped.
I think the transmission was replaced because there was a US stamp on it or something that made me think it wasn't the original. I used the torque converter that was in the transmision although I didn't drain it. It seemed to spin more freely than the other and the fluid from the tranny looked clean and there was almost no shavings on the drain plug. I did a cooler flush twice with some of those cans of tranny flush and blew compressed air through it during and after.

I'm thinking about straining the fluid through a filter and reusing it and changing the tranny filter, just to see if it changes anything.
Bad idea? Could be a quick cheap fix...?
Or should I spend what little money I have on a new converter, fluid, filter and tranny flush and see what happens? I know I should, but I'm afraid it may not fix anything if it is the governor. Anybody know anything about the governor?
I am just hoping to maybe find all possibilities and remedies before I crack it open and reinstall it. I would suck to spend all the money and time and still be stuck in the mud.
 
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