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Discussion Starter #1
I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

So the Coopers don't do well on Ice at all. In all fairness it's not their fault, but the lifted ford F250 had no problem stopping and I just locked up. I was going down hill at about 15 mph hit the brakes, slid, let off the brakes and applied them again, slid, let off again so I could try to steer to the right of him (after realizing I was not going to be able to stop) and clipped the right corner of his bumper with my fender.

So I may have to make lemonade with these lemons. Does anyone have any reasons why I would not want to just go ahead and convert the front to 2010+? Have their been any new "kits" that make the headlights "plug and play"? I have followed every conversion on this site so I know what is needed, I am just curious if there have been any breakthroughs now that more folks have done this.

 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Just out of curiousty, did the ABS not work? I don't have to worry about ice or too often here in Houston, but it seems like the ABS should have not allowed the tires to slide. (of course that doesn't help now)

You obviously are going to need a new fender and probably a hood (hope you have insurance). Did you get it checked by a professional to make sure there wasn't any frame or suspension damage? It's hard to tell whether the bumper will need to be replaced, but it looks like maybe so.

Since you know the parts, necessary work and can get the prices, seems like an easy math/personal choice decision - namely, replacing one main light and turn signal light fixtures verses two full replacements, modifications for the harness and LED issues (if I've read the conversion posts correctly) and personal satisfaction. If you were seriously thinking about it anyway seems like an obvious time to do it.
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Just out of curiousty, did the ABS not work? I don't have to worry about ice or too often here in Houston, but it seems like the ABS should have not allowed the tires to slide. (of course that doesn't help now)
If you're not running ice/snow tires the ABS isn't going to help much even if it is functional.

Also that's a tough break, assuming you're okay, so that's good! :)
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

I have the coopers too and they do just fine on the ice IMO. I have a very steep hill near my house and have never had any issues on it with the zeons (though would never dream of taking it at 15 MPH in icy conditions). The other day it was literally covered in a thick sheet of black ice, other vehicles were making it about half way up (at which point there is a sharp corner) and then sliding backwards all the way down (and luckily not hitting anything that I witnessed). I went right up with no problem (after I made sure the road was clear for me), and back down using HDC when I returned from the store. We had similar conditions a couple years ago before I had the coopers and it was a no-go for me.

No question that studded snow tires will be WAY more effective, but I just wanted a versatile tire to use year round for all purposes.
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Also, regarding the ABS, I actually tend to disable it in snow/ice as I feel it drastically increases stopping distances because it kicks in way too easily. If he didn't have studs/chains, I'd say it is likely that is why the other truck stopped more easily... I dunno about that one, but my f-250 only had rear ABS and the front is what is mostly responsible for stopping.

I'm pretty sure the snow/ice setting on newer RR probably drastically changes the ABS/traction control responses.
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

I have the coopers too and they do just fine on the ice IMO. I have a very steep hill near my house and have never had any issues on it with the zeons (though would never dream of taking it at 15 MPH in icy conditions). The other day it was literally covered in a thick sheet of black ice, other vehicles were making it about half way up (at which point there is a sharp corner) and then sliding backwards all the way down (and luckily not hitting anything that I witnessed). I went right up with no problem (after I made sure the road was clear for me), and back down using HDC when I returned from the store. We had similar conditions a couple years ago before I had the coopers and it was a no-go for me.

No question that studded snow tires will be WAY more effective, but I just wanted a versatile tire to use year round for all purposes.
You've had luck with HDC on ice? I tried to be fancy one time and half way down the hill I had to shut it off as it was running the range toward a ditch. It works great on dirt/loose rock, but on ice/mud it hasn't worked for me. Since then I deal with hills in manual mode 1st gear.
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Yeah, you have to start out from a stop and just barely crawl really slow and don't increase speed at all. If you go too fast its all over. Note, if you had pulled the fuse for the ABS, your HDC probably wouldn't do much? I assume it wouldn't even engage in that case though (never tried). It actually works really well for me *shrug*.
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Yeah I always stop before using it, nothing wrong with my ABS but yeah, if ABS doesn't work neither will HDC. For me it has never functioned well on ice/slick mud or around downhill turns for that matter. In dry conditions it's great, whoknows.
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

You can pay someone to pound out that dent on the hood (at least my body man could). Go for the 2010 conversion. Why not?
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Might as well go for the 2010 conversion.

Did this happen as you were coming back from Tahoe on the 80? We drove back Sunday night and the place was a huge mess... the Coopers survived. Actually kept it in snow mode most of the time and did a lot of manual shifting, and some manual pulsing of the brakes.

The wipers really suck.


Waiting, on the 80:
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Yeah I always stop before using it, nothing wrong with my ABS but yeah, if ABS doesn't work neither will HDC. For me it has never functioned well on ice/slick mud or around downhill turns for that matter. In dry conditions it's great, whoknows.
Yeah, I have spent quite a bit of time practicing in deserted areas (I like to know how to handle the vehicle in different conditions before I need to do it for real) and I've found that on the ice if I need to negotiate a steep hill, I disable the DSC/TC using the button on the dash, then I go up slow, if I feel like I'm about to slide backwards, I turn on the HDC and it will stop me so I can get started again. To go down I start from a full stop and walk it down in HDC, if I approach any significant turn or stop, then I use the cruise control buttons to bring it down to near zero in advance. It is slow going for sure, but has always worked. I literally had a guy watch me go down like that on an icy hill, I could see him behind standing next to his pickup truck talking to his passenger making fun of me for going so slow. Once I was down, I saw him proceed to drive down and promptly slide sideways off the road into the woods down an embankment and hit a stone wall. Of course, this is anecdotal evidence, and I may well have been able to drive carefully without HDC, but I like how it forces you to stay at a crawl so you aren't tempted to pick up speed when you shouldn't.

If the conditions are not as severe, I wouldn't always bother with the HDC because it is overkill in many situations.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Thanks for all the responses! Cody I was in SoCal coming home from Big Bear. I did have the ABS on, but we were going down a hill that I just did not know how slick it was. I was behind this guy for 40 minutes driving in 1st gear letting the car control my speed. Traffic really sucked and cars were in the ditches all over the place. I actually think that my newly upgraded EBC Rotors and Greenstuff pads might have too much initial bite and that could have been a factor here. There just does not seem to be very good modulation with that set up. I am going to be looking into this further after I get the car back from the body shop.

Any way, yes I will need a new fender (no damage under the fender, it is just peeled back from the underbody, no damage at all under the hood), new bumper, new driver's side headlight and a new hood.

I will let you know how it goes.
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

To answer your original question, my 2003 conversion is about half way finished at the shop right now. The tail lights and side vents were very easy. It only took me and a friend to do with very simple tools and about an hour. The front is a different story. I dropped it off at the body shop. Purchased headlights and grille from ebay used. I searched everywhere for a good used front bumper but no luck. Bought a new one from dealer (exspensive when you add sensors, fog lights, trim, etc.). As far as making the job easy, I do have the wiring diagram for the headlight swap. Your actual plug will fit right in to the 2010 assembly, just needs to be repined. My 2003 did not work that easy. Had to purchase a 120.00 kit from the UK. Let me know if you decide to go for it and I will answer any questions I can to make it easier.
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

So after tomorrow I will no longer be a part of this forum (for now).

When my car went to the body shop for the accident above, I was astonished to find out that the previous owner had crashed my car worse than me. In fact, he had hit it hard enough to crush the right front frame member crumple zone. Worse though, is the fact that they did everything they could to hide it! They actually heated the frame member and pulled it back out! I don't want to go into the gory details, but needless to say CarFax is not good enough and you should always have a car inspected before you buy it. I got a great deal on it, and now I know why. So I just bought a CPO 2010 Mercedes GL450 (really missed having a third row seat while in the Rover). I would have bought a 550, but I am taking a bath on the Rover so I had to step it back a notch.

Best to you all! Drive safely!!!
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

The Benz is a sweet truck. Bluetec would have made it sweeter.
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Are you sure this accident didn't cause the frame damage? Did you ever have any issues with alignment or wear since you owned it?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Positive, the frame damage was to the passenger side. I hit the the driver's side. You can clearly see this is old and had been heated and pulled back out:

 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Why does this mean you have to get rid of the Rover. The crumple zone crumpled like it should, not a big deal that it was pulled out, now it will just crumple different. Is there anything else wrong with it that would mean you should get rid of it?
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

with 91k miles it's not worth putting the money into fixing right. Insurance money from my wreck plus cash for sale to someone who wants to fix it is equal to trade in value on the truck. Not worth it for a car I was planning on selling before it hits 100k miles.
 

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Re: I might be doing a 2010+ Front end conversion sooner than planned...

Why does this mean you have to get rid of the Rover. The crumple zone crumpled like it should, not a big deal that it was pulled out, now it will just crumple different. Is there anything else wrong with it that would mean you should get rid of it?
I agree. I understand you are thinking of getting rid of it before 100K, but what does "fixing it right" mean? It seems that if the bumper and everything else lines up (which apparently it did), it was fixed "right". Obviously, it's your decision, but personally I wouldn't let this weigh heavily on the decision.
 
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