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After watching the Super Bowl ads and seeing a lot of the automobiles that are out right now, I'm really hoping that LR has something impressive up its sleeve. Our latest gen of RRS was refreshed for 2010, but I "feel" like I'm driving a much older car. I realize this was designed for 2005, but there are plenty of things that could've been updated through these 7 years. My sister finally took delivery of her Evoque Dynamic Coupe and though it's an impressive machine, I'm getting more and more disappointed watching companies like Hyundai come out with cars that have many of the same features, for like $23K. Where in the heck is remote start for a $60,000 Evoque? A relatively ugly Infiniti FX50 has most of the things the Evoque has, does 0-60 in about 5 flat and even has air conditioned seats.... for $60,000. The new Jeep SRT8 is $60,000 and competes with the Sport. (No, I don't want the Infiniti. It's just a comparison. The Jeep though...) The telematics systems in even the new Rovers are about 5 years behind with their latest iteration. You can put your own screen saver on a Dodge Avenger. "Our new 'Say What You See Technology'...." New? That's new? I had that in my Infiniti in 2008, and there were companies who had it before even that. I saw JLR showing that you can show your Blackberry screen up on the telematic screen as a prototype. Now we're getting somewhere. Don't worry though. Mini, Hyundai, Toyota and other brands are already rolling that technology out. They're doing it for iPhone and Android. You know, the companies that aren't going to disappear soon. Blackberry? We get "Say What You See" for 2012? A little late to the party, aren't we? Not only that, but they don't navigate properly. I use my Galaxy S to navigate now. I told my wife to do the same.

I took a day trip to SW Wisconsin to break up the winter. I programmed Spring Green into my nav and followed it. (About 200 miles from my house.) I watched the road signs that said Spring Green pass me by. You would think, "Well, moron, why didn't you follow the signs?" Because for $78,000, I would hope my car would know how to do that. That's cheap compared to our full-size bretheren. I was wondering why my car was shooting me so far north, then back to the south again. It doesn't navigate properly 75% of the time. That's a horrible percentage. I don't have any restrictions set on my nav. New owners, I urge you to just use your phone or a Garmin. They can save you a lot of time and gas. (BTW, my average MPG for that tank of fuel registered 20.9 MPG. I did the math and came up with 17.2. How the hell can you be that far off metering fuel going into the engine? Others on this forum are now seeing that they have the same thing. I've never had a car that would meter fuel this poorly. Yes, even Kias have fuel meters in them that work properly.)

Before you think I'm just bashing our beloved brand into the ground, we have 5 LR's in our family now. I am, by no means, calling our cars piles of crap. By no means.

I was telling Mensa on here, why can't they just build a simple air suspension that works. I mean even Jeep has it and I haven't heard much coming from their camp. There are other companies with air springs, and the only time you hear of a problem with them is when they just wear out. That's not even a reliability gripe. That's a simple design gripe. We shoot rockets into space and design satellites for less money than it takes to design a car. They seem to do a pretty good job with them. They don't even get a "test run." We still have people with wheel bearing failiures. Really? Failing diffs? What? (I have not seen any of those problems and am aware that our reliability has come a long way over the past half-decade.) Why do our brake pads disappear so fast? My wife's ex-Denali went 70,000 miles of hard driving without a pad change.

There are so many positives for these vehicles. So many! The price of the positives vs. negatives are starting to even out now. I am actually surprised that the Evoque doesn't have more "bells and whistles" for the price. I know they're Land Rovers, but there was a long time where we could say, "Your car doesn't have this... or that.. mine does." I just don't find that happening with this latest line. I'm well aware that the new Full Size may be released this year. Like I said at the beginning of this, they'd better have some really neat stuff up their sleeve because their latest just isn't cutting it anymore for this price. The only way I'd justify these cars anymore, except possibly for the Evoque, is if I'd get them used.

Come on, JLR. Let's make these things better than the rest of the world again. When I say better, I mean with technology. I know the new 5.0L motor is a marvel of tech, but why am I only getting 17 MPG highway and 18 with the 375 HP version? You used to be the model of cutting edge machines. I actually think the XJ is the most advanced vehicle in the fleet, but compared it to even a Lexus LS, and they're still way behind.

All that I've stated above is just an opinion I'm starting to feel. I am not trying to offend my fellow RRS drivers. I still love driving my truck every day, but am starting to feel like SAAB owners (used to) feel. I'm also hoping that Tata's promise of spending billions for engineering starts to pay off shortly.

I just don't want a car that's awesome to look at anymore. I am politely asking for something that's more befitting of the price. (What a selfish prick, huh?)

Please, you guys. I'm not trying to offend anyone. I'm not in here trying to just stir the pot. I just feel that our favortie car company is drastically falling behind and needs to seriously catch up, or we might not be around for the long haul. It's all just an opinion. I have no plans to sell my car at this moment because there are still plenty of reasons that make it stand out and also make it a great car.

Your thoughts? Are you hoping we really step it up for the new generation? Do you hope this happens without a drastic price increase like has been rumored? I'd love to hear if what you guys think. What would you like to see for the latest generation? Do you think JLR held off on a lot of stuff for the Evoque waiting for the new Full Size? I'd also like to hear if you think I'm way off-base here. Remember, I'm not saying I'm right about all of this. I'm just throwing it out on the table for a polite discussion.
 

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I can see where you are coming from on some of these issues. One of my gripes is that the rear seat entertainment system in our truck does not have lcd screens nor does it play Blu-Ray disks. Also, I feel as if all Land Rover models above the LR2 should either have semi-analine leather standard or available, with it being standard on all Range Rover trim levels. Otherwise, I have no complaints about the content level in our 11 Range Rover. It would be great to see the quality be brought up to Lexus levels. I have already had my 4 month old Range Rover in the shop more than our Lexus has the past 3 years! But all in all, I am stuck on Land Rover and look forward to buying another Range Rover or a Range Rover Sport a few years down the road.
 

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When I first started reading this thread I thought to myself how much of a rant this was going to be, but as it turns out you've hit the nail spot on! I couldn't agree more about the technology upgrades mostly today which are becoming standard creature comforts in basic cars. Now, yes we are driving luxury SUVs which have good competition out there with the SRT8, FX, etc. but from what I was told there is some very big technology coming our way in 2013-2014 which will step us up and into the next generation of software engineering. The way I look at it right now is the company has plateaud, while other smaller outfits have stepped up to the plate to deliver the goods. I almost pulled the trigger on another Denali for the A/C seats alone (Florida gets hot!) but in the end decided on the craftsmanship of the styling and the SC performance. It's also something for me to be proud of personally as a major milestone in my life and a big accomplishment. So for now, I do agree and am patient to wait for the next go-round where it's LR's turn to raise the bar, but thankful for being a new owner!
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
JMC, it's great to hear you love your truck and it has all the stuff you want and need. We like seeing your input on this.

Headrush, thanks for kind of seeing where I'm coming from and for reading the whole post. It's not that we don't like them. We love them! They are their own breed, but genetics has the rest of the pack catching up. We spend this amount of money to get the latest and greatest. Something you have pride going, "My RRS has this, and the rest of the world doesn't." A perfect example of this is our cars are mountain goats. The other brands are poseurs in a way. We like knowing we have a mountain goat, though there are only a select few of us who take our trucks through the wilderness. (The new SC is sure a quick beast, isn't it Headrush?)

I had to talk my wife into the Sport. She really wanted the FFRR, but that was even more expensive for things that her Denali had. Headrush, you are kind of getting what I'm saying because even you were cross-shopping a Denali. I really miss my A/C seats from my old Infiniti FX. It's like people who had a power liftgate. It took us until 2012 to even get that. People who haven't had a power liftgate have to have it to believe in it.

Okay, excellent job so far. If you didn't read my whole post, please read it through. This offer is also for our friends in all other categories of the Range Rover forum. We don't care what you drive. We're all family. We all share the same "parents." Let everyone know what you think. We want to hear.
 

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You guys know what's in store for the 2013 Range Rover flagship, right? This is just a hint of what's coming in new off-road technology, quoting an insider magazine article:

The next Range Rover will have ground-breaking off-road technology when it is launched at the end of 2012.

Called Terrain-i, the tech is a more sophisticated version of the company's Terrain Response system, which is fitted to all models. The new version uses a suite of electronic aids, so that drivers don't need to select which type of electronic off-road assistance is needed – the car 'looks ahead' at the terrain and does it for you.

Also on the new Range Rover will be a Wade Aid device, which uses sonar to measure water depth ahead to ensure that it is safe to traverse. It will also, if required, pre-select the correct speed and gear required to go through the water.

The Terrain-i system also uses cameras to look ahead and assess topography of the environment you are driving in. It decides whether the car is capable of negotiating the terrain and if not, the sat-nav reroutes you.

In time, this technology, or parts of it, will trickle down to other Land Rover models. However, the next all-new Range Rover is likely to have other technologies designed to improve its on-road performance.
We'll see if this technology turns out on the new Range Rover (which will also be 1,000+ lbs lighter than the current one.) Will it be reliable? Who knows, but I can't wait to see how the new Infiniti FX, Jeep Grand Hillbilly SRT8, Bimmer XYZ and Lexus Bored Cruiser plan on negotiating water crossings next year to keep up with a Range Rover! A big chuck of change in the price of a Land Rover goes in technology that 99% of owners never even begin to appreciate and could care less about, unfortunately. For most of us here, air suspensions are cool because we can look really slammed when parked with the right set of 22", Terrain Response is nice to have when we go skiing twice a year, although amazingly enough the car still appears to slide all over the place on summer tires, whassup Land Rover?!? ;) I am sure the new creature comfort technology on the upcoming Range Rover platform - that the new Range Rover Sport will also be based on eventually - will be on par with other vehicles in its class, but in-cabin gadgetry has never been Land Rover's forte. Ferrari and Lamborghini have pretty pathetic navigation systems as well, at least compared to a Ford Flex. But that's not why people buy them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
You guys know what's in store for the 2013 Range Rover flagship, right? This is just a hint of what's coming in new off-road technology, quoting an insider magazine article:



We'll see if this technology turns out on the new Range Rover (which will also be 1,000+ lbs lighter than the current one.) Will it be reliable? Who knows, but I can't wait to see how the new Infiniti FX, Jeep Grand Hillbilly SRT8, Bimmer XYZ and Lexus Bored Cruiser plan on negotiating water crossings next year to keep up with a Range Rover! A big chuck of change in the price of a Land Rover goes in technology that 99% of owners never even begin to appreciate and could care less about, unfortunately. For most of us here, air suspensions are cool because we can look really slammed when parked with the right set of 22", Terrain Response is nice to have when we go skiing twice a year, although amazingly enough the car still appears to slide all over the place on summer tires, whassup Land Rover?!? ;) I am sure the new creature comfort technology on the upcoming Range Rover platform - that the new Range Rover Sport will also be based on eventually - will be on par with other vehicles in its class, but in-cabin gadgetry has never been Land Rover's forte. Ferrari and Lamborghini have pretty pathetic navigation systems as well, at least compared to a Ford Flex. But that's not why people buy them.
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Umberto, master of all things Rover, we are more than happy to hear what you think of the next Gen. So many good points.

Sent from my US Cellular Android phone.
 

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Who is this "WE" you keep referencing? Have you taken up a job with Land Rover?
 

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Personally, I'd rather see the latest and greatest reserved for the FSRR and keep the Sport somewhat spartan. But we all know that isn't going to happen.
 

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Weatherman, when my wife found out I brought home the supercharged, she asked if it was part of our deal. I said of course, now go take her out for a spin and when she started the car she said "Whoah, it sounds like a tiger in a cage". Then we took the SC on the road and all my wife did was smile. The rest is history.

Case in poiny the srt8 is fast, but for $60k lacks the quality craftsmanship that LR has and doesn't feel like a luxury suv. If my SC had AC seats and better UI design on the nav that's really all I need. I think the extra $10k premium for the RR is worth the power and performance being in a more rare car that I can say I'm proud of. :razz:
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
Weatherman, when my wife found out I brought home the supercharged, she asked if it was part of our deal. I said of course, now go take her out for a spin and when she started the car she said "Whoah, it sounds like a tiger in a cage". Then we took the SC on the road and all my wife did was smile. The rest is history.

Case in poiny the srt8 is fast, but for $60k lacks the quality craftsmanship that LR has and doesn't feel like a luxury suv. If my SC had AC seats and better UI design on the nav that's really all I need. I think the extra $10k premium for the RR is worth the power and performance being in a more rare car that I can say I'm proud of. :razz:
Exactly, sir! Exactly! The thing is a beast, and I love it for that. It's also different, which is also part of its allure.

That is one of the problems of the Jeep and even the M-series Bimmers. There are so many on the road. The Porsche is just, well, amazingly expensive for what you get.

The UI. You hit the nail on the head. A/C seats. That should be standard. Make the thing lighter. I'm hoping for more "on-road" bells and whistles, not just the ability to use sonar in a creek and radar up a trail like Umberto's article was he just posted above. I actually would also like the full TFT display perfected and put in the Sport. You would think that's getting cheaper to do than using actual gauges anyway, right? In my opinion, a bunch of different gauge layouts would be awesome for the TFT. User customizable or just a whole bunch of different presets. More than what's avaliable in the FFRR. That would be kind of fun. Heck, for those who don't want it, make it an option. (I know there will be folks who say, "I only want real gauges." For you, I'm getting you a radio with knobs and a little, red needle that goes along the frequency range. Come on, I'm kidding.)

That's the kind of stuff though. Make it different. Make it excel. Make it one of those cars that you say, "Hey, look what this thing can do! Have you ever seen anything like this before?" I also don't want the price to go flying up just because of some bells and whistles. Screens, linked to small computers, linked to new programs aren't expensive to engineer or build. The fact that my gauge TFT is greyscale, while a Ford truck has a full, hi-res color computer in there is the kind of stuff where we can start. (I still want a full, customizable TFT though.)

Edit: Oh, oh! I have another one! A user selectable boost gauge for SC owners, and a vacuum gauge for fun for NA owners. Again, other cars have this. That's a fun, little perk!
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Oh boy. I have more for the Sport.

Each one of these can be TFT selectable. Oil temp. Oil pressure. Transmission temp. If we want to be trucks, let's be trucks.

An app that your phone runs, that sends a whole, boatload of info to your telematics system. Weather, stocks, news. Incoming text messages or emails are fed through this system, via the app and read through a text to speech program. This tech is already on the market. Pandora or something similar. Google maps for Nav. That would bring in traffic without having to subscribe to Sirius XM NavTraffic for $5 a month. Take advantage of the passenger split-screen tech here in the States. That's so awesome! Have a built-in digital HDTV (QAM) tuner for that. Make the screen huge with super-high resolution. AMOLED tech is the best. (See Samsung tech. If you have a Galaxy S phone, you have AMOLED. Nothing like it.) This is the kind of stuff. It's not expensive to put in, but makes you say, "Man, this Sport really is over-the-top. I love it even more!"
 

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Oh boy. I have more for the Sport.

Each one of these can be TFT selectable. Oil temp. Oil pressure. Transmission temp. If we want to be trucks, let's be trucks.

An app that your phone runs, that sends a whole, boatload of info to your telematics system. Weather, stocks, news. Incoming text messages or emails are fed through this system, via the app and read through a text to speech program. This tech is already on the market. Pandora or something similar. Google maps for Nav. That would bring in traffic without having to subscribe to Sirius XM NavTraffic for $5 a month. Take advantage of the passenger split-screen tech here in the States. That's so awesome! Have a built-in digital HDTV (QAM) tuner for that. Make the screen huge with super-high resolution. AMOLED tech is the best. (See Samsung tech. If you have a Galaxy S phone, you have AMOLED. Nothing like it.) This is the kind of stuff. It's not expensive to put in, but makes you say, "Man, this Sport really is over-the-top. I love it even more!"
I believe all this is coming. RIM just showed off a ton of stuff at CES in January and got an award with their Porsche concept. Their integration with OnStar looks great as well. Sadly I don't have it yet but as with all of my cars, I look forward to what my next one brings.

I might have lost the AC Seats, power lift gate and remote start but I drive a Land Rover now (again). Couldn't be happier with my current truck. If nothing changes in 2-3 years when I am due for an upgrade than I will wait or look at something else (hope not though).

RIM owns the company that makes the software for the full size Range Rover screen, among other systems in the trucks now.

Nice relationship with Samsung (automotive) through that I would imagine also.
 

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(which will also be 1,000+ lbs lighter than the current one.)
I don't know if I'm alone here or not but I'm not thrilled that they are working on making them lighter. I know it will help fuel economy but to me safety is more important. For the most part the LR lineup (LR4, RRS, FSRR) all weigh about the same as other large SUV's on the road. Weighing the same or more than 98% of any other passenger vehicles out there gives you a better chance of walking away should you be involved in an accident with someone else.

Personally, if the LR lineup has transitioned to weighing 1/2 ton less than other luxury SUV's out there when I'm ready for a new one I will likely buy a different brand.

Totally agree on the other technical aspects though. I was driving a loaded EB Ford Expedition in 2005 that had, NAV, RES with IR headphones, AC seats, self leveling suspension, power fold 3rd row, and a bunch of other goodies that I paid less than 50k new for.

Hope that doesn't come across as a bit** about my RRS though. I love it even though it isn't as full of tech gear as I'd like. I have a friend who drives a 20 volvo wagon with over half a million miles on it. He is always telling me the less a car has on it the less there is to break and the longer it will last. There is something to that line of thinking!
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I believe all this is coming. RIM just showed off a ton of stuff at CES in January and got an award with their Porsche concept. Their integration with OnStar looks great as well. Sadly I don't have it yet but as with all of my cars, I look forward to what my next one brings.

I might have lost the AC Seats, power lift gate and remote start but I drive a Land Rover now (again). Couldn't be happier with my current truck. If nothing changes in 2-3 years when I am due for an upgrade than I will wait or look at something else (hope not though).

RIM owns the company that makes the software for the full size Range Rover screen, among other systems in the trucks now.

Nice relationship with Samsung (automotive) through that I would imagine also.
Wow! Thanks FlyersFan! I looked it up. Funny, that's exactly what I'm talking about. My only problem is that it's RIM. They are so far behind and fading fast in the smartphone world.

 

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I don't know if I'm alone here or not but I'm not thrilled that they are working on making them lighter. I know it will help fuel economy but to me safety is more important. For the most part the LR lineup (LR4, RRS, FSRR) all weigh about the same as other large SUV's on the road. Weighing the same or more than 98% of any other passenger vehicles out there gives you a better chance of walking away should you be involved in an accident with someone else.

Personally, if the LR lineup has transitioned to weighing 1/2 ton less than other luxury SUV's out there when I'm ready for a new one I will likely buy a different brand.

Totally agree on the other technical aspects though. I was driving a loaded EB Ford Expedition in 2005 that had, NAV, RES with IR headphones, AC seats, self leveling suspension, power fold 3rd row, and a bunch of other goodies that I paid less than 50k new for.

Hope that doesn't come across as a bit** about my RRS though. I love it even though it isn't as full of tech gear as I'd like. I have a friend who drives a 20 volvo wagon with over half a million miles on it. He is always telling me the less a car has on it the less there is to break and the longer it will last. There is something to that line of thinking!
I remember a news article or television new brief over 15 years ago about how the industry needs to do a few things to their trucks. Lower bumpers, lighter, etc. They need to make the trucks safer for cars in the event of an accident.

My first thought was, "So the government wants to make trucks less safe so that they match better with cars and not just make cars safer. Yeah that is backwards thinking."
 

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Wow! Thanks FlyersFan! I looked it up. Funny, that's exactly what I'm talking about. My only problem is that it's RIM. They are so far behind and fading fast in the smartphone world.

RIM bought QNX. Other than being owned by them I can't see QNX crapping the bed to early. Hope not there are a lot of plains, trains and automobiles that are dependent on QNX. Not to mention nuclear power plants and elevators.

Have a look at what the editor at Crackberry wrote about his plans for what QNX can bring to the table.

http://crackberry.com/how-rim-can-win-next-great-tablet-race-playbook-cars-factory

It is LR related also as he drivers a Range Rover (just not sure if it is the Full Size or the Sport)
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I know this was posted before, but here was JLR working with QNX. It's a bummer that they're owned by RIM. Blackberry users, if you haven't used Android or iOS, you don't know what you're missing. RIM is dying. Google should snap up QNX.

Again, FlyersFan, thanks for bringing all this up.

 

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"So the government wants to make trucks less safe so that they match better with cars and not just make cars safer. Yeah that is backwards thinking."
Agreed. My understanding is the main driving factor now is updated CAFE which among other things is what is causing the push to lighten vehicles with a side effect of also raising the cost to make up for the additional expense of lighter weight materials. I'm not a fan!
 

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After watching the Super Bowl ads and seeing a lot of the automobiles that are out right now....
Weatherman - I was thinking about this thread this past weekend. I was driving by my local Ford dealership on Sunday and saw a loaded up Ford Raptor SCREW (6.2L) sitting on their lot. It is a truck I've looked at online several times but never drove. I decided to stop and check it out. The first thing I noticed was how much better the Sync system was over the system I had in my RRS. Anyway long story short I got a wild hair and decided it was time for a change (I know I only had my 11 RRSSC for 8 months but I did have my 07 RRS for a while before that). I called my LR dealer on Monday and asked if they wanted to buy my RRS from me. They offered me what I considered a fair price so I sold it to them and then went down and bought the Raptor. The RRS and Raptor are obviously very different vehicles so there isn't really a way to compare them but I will say that I paid $20k less for my 2012 Raptor than I did for my 2011 RRSSC and I got heated/AC seats, remote start, and all the other current times electronics that you might expect in a vehicle that exceeds $50k in the Raptor. An added bonus is I'm also now the hero of all the construction crews in my neighborhood and everyone knows when I'm coming by because they hear me from a mile away. :) What I didn't get was headlights. The headlights on the Raptor are a joke and Ford missed the boat big time IMHO.
 

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It will be a nice to have to see all this info being displayed on the screen, text messages etc. But with supposedly new laws to be passed limiting texting, and possibly other limitations (who knows what), would it really be worth having these items. I rather have a nice interface from my smart phone that has a HDMI port to be able to use 1 device to see all the info pertinent to me and able to control via the 8" screen, I can then take my smart phone anywhere rather than limited to features in the car. Also less electronics to go wrong, which we know LR is not the best at. They will install all these features and then lock it down because the vehicle is in motion due to US laws.
 
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