RangeRovers.net Forum banner

1 - 20 of 25 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hello everyone :thumb:

Good to be here and find a lot of Rangie enthusiasts. :clap: My husband and I live in Queensland, Australia and have had 3 Rangies previously and are onto our 4th. Unfortunately with not as much success as the others (a classic,Vogue and HSE). We have now a green 1998 P38 purchased mid MAY this year, off a man who thought he knew all there was to know about Rangies (in other words they were like 'conventional' cars you can just pull down and put back together!! with a lot of silicone to boot) nevertheless I won't start discussing this as it is a long drawn out story still in the process of seeking legal help. Right from the beginning we were told false facts about what he had done and not done to this Rangie, considering we had some knowledge of them (and by no means does that mean any more than some) we purchased the vehicle with a current roadworthy and everything seemed ok. Now to cut a long story short she wasn't 'ok' and we have had some very bad headaches with her but perservered. This latest one has me baffled as I will explain. My husband has had a hip replacement for the 3rd time and now a rod in his leg down to the knee so cannot be as active as he was previously with car maintenance. I have always been interested in cars, trucks, buses and planes and all that mechanical and this has come in handy with the Rangie as he is paraplegic from the chest down due to a spinal injury so working on the car is difficult. It's a case of where there is a will there's a way. To get to the point with her this is the picture.

1998 P38 Range Rover block says 4litre but previous owner fitted a 4.6L when the first engine blew up due to his stupidity of not checking water in the engine and overheating. That engine had done 274,000klm. No off road that we know of - used for hauling a very long work caravan for business. The replacement engine alledgedly a 4.6L and he has since done approximately 5-6,000 k with it procured from a Rangie in Cairns that had a write off crash. The problem being he thought he knew as well as the so called mechanic he got to put it in did which he was meant to provide us with receipts and ALL PAPERWORK, which he always managed to get out off. We purchased it 1200klm away from home and although not rushed but had other surgery health issues going on at the same time. Our bad management.

We did all the usual took it for an extended long test drive on highway and 60klm area, looked through the engine and was promised that a couple of items my husband picked up would be fixed on going through final roadworthy but he lied and already had a roadworthy 3 days before we looked at it and didn't tell us. We have a case going at present with Queensland Transport as to the methods he procured a Safety Certificate. Nevertheless, by the time we got to our home destination she was riding on the bump stops, further investigation after much to do found that the front left airbag was ripped and after all the damage driving the car on the bump stops we decided on the coil conversion as other damage had occurred. Not that we wanted too as we bought another Rangie for the smooth ride for my husband.
After painfully trying to negiotiate with the waffling ex owner, we decided to put her in for a full check up (SAFETY INPECTION) with a very reputable large Rangie Rover dealership. They were extremely helpful and informative and presented us with a list of UNROADWORTHY ITEMS that we have been working through to fix. The airbag system fix was too costly for us so we had the coil conversion done. Something that we were not prepared for being on restricted income and all our monies going to health crisis for both of us.

So the work we have done is as follows-

Coil Conversion Kit $1950 including
Bushes and Antirollbar R/R
Tie Rod End R/R
Track Rod R/R
Air Freight Charges getting city parts
Wheel Alignment of 45.00
Labour of $658.75
------------------------------
TOTALLING $A3273.30
------------------------------

THEN more
Lower Control Arm Bushes 120.00
Radius Rod Bushes 27.00
Seal 35.00
Dust Boot 18.50
-----------------------------
TOTALLING $A220.55
-----------------------------

THEN 2MTHS LATER AS funds permitted another 18.75 hrs labour at $A1125.00 for various, filters, checking oil leak, spark plugs, f brake pads (we still can't work out how she got RWC) machining of discs, servicing of the 8 injectors (didn't realise why she was sluggish only firing on 6 not 8) 02 sensor (which again should have been addressed at RWC inspection considering emission laws) fuel filter and again wheel alignment
all tyres had to be replaced as only one passable according to Ultratune so that was another $1200 for Cooper tyres - something that would last! We go outback a lot used to live there.
------------------------------
TOTALLING $A2216.35
------------------------------

Now OVER $5700 later, all this time, later we are still having problems.....

Half the time I have been dealing with this myself trying to get it fixed while my husband was in hospital but unfortunately being a woman with a 'broken car' can lead to all types of attitudes from the opposite sex. It's unfortunate this still happens and the minority spoil it for the majority. So hence my search on the net for some technical advice and assistance I HOPE.

She has been going fine no problems with the exception of the beep beep warning of the drivers door not being closed properly of course it is but the mechanics when servicing her had no idea how to go into the computer (we live in a regional town) and fix it. No Rangie specialists here! The coil conversion had a patch with it to fix the air suspension error.

So this is the only area I have had a problem with up until 3 days ago when I went out to get into the car and start her as usual. All I got was the click click click when turning the ignition key and a very faint operating screen so I thought I had a flat battery but after 24hrs plus on the charger the battery is showing that it is fine. Still the same click click click when I turn the key. The windows, radio and everything else seems to work but a bit slow. Last night I went out again to try her and now there were several error messages, first one was 'gearbox fault', then ABS problem, then I notice the low fuel light on when I know I had half a tank. There seemed to be all weird messages coming up and the light was very dull on the panel.

Once it said all this I turned it off came inside quite worried and my husband today is trying to enjoy his Bathhurst 1000 Race Day without worrying :( about the damned RANGIE!!!!!

Can you guys tell me where to start and what to look for I have checked all the obvious connections etc.

I hope I have given enough information but please come back to me if you want to know anything else.

Hoping you can shed some light on this.........I love Rangies but this is proving a real trial and a half!!!! :pray: :pray:
 

·
Registered
1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
Joined
·
865 Posts
Firts off on a rangie of this year model I wouldnt bother with a dealer.
1. They will find fault with anything to make the extra to pay for the dealership fees.
2. I work on these rangies alot and I've yet to find the perfect rangie, it doesnt happen as owners are not prepared to spend
3. Your topic posting was "Rangie wont start" does the engine turn over, do you have dash lights etc
4. Air bags are perisable items, the moment they start showing cracks they should be replaced.
5. Going to coils is a devide debut, some like, some not.
6. The P38 is a complex but good vehicle to own, I should know as I too own one and enjoy it

You need to speak to people in your area and if you are lucky enough you will locate someone who has a passion for these
vehicles like me and works to a high standard, I have customers travelling 1000km's for me to repair as they have given up
on dealers and other garages for repairs.

As I say "To know one is to own one" but Im rather far from you so cant help
Dont give up and ask around
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
I don't bother with dealerships generally as they are too expensive but I wanted someone who knew what they were talking about especially when we are not living in the metro areas of Australia.
There are only about 8000 people where we live and a major town is 1200klm away so it's not that easy to get good service. Especially knowing someone that loves and works on rangies.
There's nothing perfect in life that's for sure!
As I said in my post the engine does not run it does the click click click and then nothing and yes there is dash lights but faded as I stated.
The coil saga is over I just need to fix this one and get her going again, I am thinking it must be in the electrics somewhere.
All Rangies are good to own but like a lot of people say a unit is only good when it's going!! and yes I haven't given up but I need to find a solution!
Thanks for your post.




viperover said:
Firts off on a rangie of this year model I wouldnt bother with a dealer.
1. They will find fault with anything to make the extra to pay for the dealership fees.
2. I work on these rangies alot and I've yet to find the perfect rangie, it doesnt happen as owners are not prepared to spend
3. Your topic posting was "Rangie wont start" does the engine turn over, do you have dash lights etc
4. Air bags are perisable items, the moment they start showing cracks they should be replaced.
5. Going to coils is a devide debut, some like, some not.
6. The P38 is a complex but good vehicle to own, I should know as I too own one and enjoy it

You need to speak to people in your area and if you are lucky enough you will locate someone who has a passion for these
vehicles like me and works to a high standard, I have customers travelling 1000km's for me to repair as they have given up
on dealers and other garages for repairs.

As I say "To know one is to own one" but Im rather far from you so cant help
Dont give up and ask around
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
701 Posts
The battery might need to be replaced. I get "gearbox fault" and "abs malfunction" whenever I am on a low battery. What kind of voltages are you getting on the battery?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
649 Posts
Bluntly, we can't do anything about the back story. We can only help with the current problem(s) with the car, not other people.

Whether you do work yourself, or have to monitor what other people do, a copy of the Workshop and Electrical manuals are essential. Google Green Oval RAVE and go from there, they are free downloads, although you need some computer skills to convert Disc Images to CDs, but you can probably find that locally if you don't have the skills yourself.

I agree with your own and lrscott analysis.
The experience which you don't have is the knowledge that low voltage will cause various error messages to appear. These don't mean what they say individually, taken together they mean 'low voltage'.
Look closely at the cleanliness and tightness of the connections between the battery terminals and the battery posts.
It has been known for the clamping bolt to shear, it's common enough for LR to issue a Technical Bulletin.
When replacing the clamps on the posts, lubricate the touching surfaces with Petroleum Jelly or Vaseline (Same stuff, different prices. These are UK terms, I don't know the Australian equivalents).

Also look at the security of the cable into the terminal.

BEFORE you take them off to clean them, wind the drivers window fully down, and leave it down, AND keep the ignition key in your pocket. Never ever leave the key in the car and the door closed / window up while working on the car.
If you leave the key on the seat and the door open, somebody, or the wind, will close the door. Thus keep the key in your pocket, and the window down, if one safety move fails the other still protects you.
This is necessary because sometimes, and most often when you reconnect the battery, the car will lock itself. This is no fun when the key is inside.

Good Luck.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Thank you Chas for your comments but the back story was only an entry into how we came to buy this rangie.

Yes it is called Vaseline here too lol! I will do this tomorrow as it is dark now and the mozzies bite furiously at dusk. I did visually check the battery posts etc but not actually take off and clean.

Thank you for your comments on keeping the keys in the pocket I realised this after reading all the different situations and circumstances you can be in and decided to do this after No. 1. Rangie's first experience.

Irscott, The reason why I dismissed the battery as being ok is that the light that says it's faulty and turns red is still clear as I have the maintenance free type battery.
I had another look at her this afternoon and there are three errors so far she's saying, 'gearbox fault', abs malfunction, eas manual. (due to the fact of the patch when coils put in)

As to voltages I haven't been able to obtain as don't have the right equipment.......
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Can anyone advise me on the price of a second hand computer system for the P38 OR the price of a new one as a matter of interest. Just trying to look ahead if this one is not fixable.
 

·
Registered
1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
Joined
·
1,365 Posts
Just chiming in here --

See the electrical sticky above and do the measurements and post them back here for an interpretation.

You will need a voltmeter - the digital ones are not expensive and very easy to use.

Good luck.
 

·
Registered
1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
Joined
·
88 Posts
Hi,

Got to agree with the battery being the problem. I recently had exactly the same problem with my 1999 4.6HSE with the starter clicking away and the 'gearbox error' message. I checked the battery and it appeared good - was a maintenance free one with the light showing green. I used some jumper cables from another car which was running and the Rangie fired up immediately. I bought a new battery and the problem was solved.

Do you have another car that you can use to jump start?

On the subject of the computer are you talking about the car's computer ie BECM or the Testbook computer used for diagnosis of problems. I doubt whether you have a BECM problem and the Testbook diagnostic computers are quite expensive although there are others such as Rovacom etc. All are quite pricey unless you plan to run a P38 for some time.

Good luck.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Thank you Tykes for your reply well I didn't jump start her incase that caused a problem but yes we have a ford in the family that can do the job, when it's light I will have a go. I need to clear the error message of the right hand door being open anyway how do you suggest I do that by buying something like this -
P38 EAS KICKER - $385.00 INC DELIVERY
NEW EAS KICKER TO SUIT P38 RANGE ROVER INCLUDING OBD11 AND UPDATE CABLE (UPGRADED SO YOU CAN RESET YOUR RIDE HIGHTS). ****IDENTIFY AND CLEAR EAS FAULTS**** (http://www.britishoffroad.com/specials.htm)

I do hope it's as easy as buying a new battery. Thing is there hasn't been any hint of the battery discharging etc or faulty. Pity the 'green light' doesn't function properly isn't it? Shall source another battery here. Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
96 Posts
Hi There, I have to agree with the previous posters, as I changed my battery on saturday.

Had the same problem, gearbox fault showing and just click click from the engine. The battery level light was still showing green as well, but when I checked the voltage it was actually dead. It never even gave me a clue that the battery was on the way out.

Looks like you have a simple fix on your hands.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
I think I have answered my query of the error messages - was just reading about the easkicker but I see that another forum has stated this -
the faultmate is a full product for I believe all systems, but the "easkicker" ONLY does the air suspension, nothing else.
So what do I need to erase the message?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
649 Posts
Which message is it that you are trying to erase, a recent one, or the one that's been there ever since you converted to coils?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
It did happen at the same time when she came back from the workshop and a tune up they had used the patch to alter/bypass the coil change it now says EAS MANUAL but I get the repeated message of RHF door open all the time of course it isn't but boy are the beeps annoying - no garage in my regional area is game to touch it and even travelling 100klm to town some places just shake their heads and won't touch a Rangie! One chap said to me sell it for god's sake and buy a decent car, you've bought a lemon. :evil: there are no excuses for some people!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Re: Air Conditioning 'trapped'?

Also another problem - this one won't stop the car from functioning but is sure hard to deal with in 35 deg heat!! Whatever the ex owner has done he seems to have '''blocked''' the air vents front and side and side. The only place the cold air comes through is the feet area - this is a help but you end up with a hot head and frozen feet. It would be lovely if it could work properly. It appears the access tubes or whatever they are called have been trapped or caught when the replacement engine was installed (he reckoned it didn't work from then) he lived in a cooler area so didn't worry him that much.
I have taken it to my local garage/maintenance man and he says the whole dash would have to come out and he's never done a Rangie before and after speaking to someone down in the city it could be an expensive job and other ''items'' could be damaged or not work when put back together????
I must try and fix it as it is boiling without it and it would be nice to have cool air on the face not on the feet all the time. Whatever has happened the drainage pipe must be caught too as the passenger front floor gets mighty wet at times and I hate the smell of damp carpet! Any suggestions gratefully received.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Well the verdict is it's not the battery or alternator. :( :( :( I have had the emergency mobile mechanic out and he said the battery is charging fine no problems (over 12 he said). He feels it COULD BE the starter motor? She is getting towed away this afternoon to the workshop - trouble is they only half know what they are doing with Rangies.

Now wonder my hair is white!! :shock:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
60 Posts
rangielover said:
Well the verdict is it's not the battery or alternator. :( :( :( I have had the emergency mobile mechanic out and he said the battery is charging fine no problems (over 12 he said). He feels it COULD BE the starter motor? She is getting towed away this afternoon to the workshop - trouble is they only half know what they are doing with Rangies.

Now wonder my hair is white!! :shock:

rangielover said:
we were not prepared for being on restricted income and all our monies going to health crisis
I love my P38. It is a blast to drive, luxurious and capable off road. But realistically they are very expensive to maintain and I think an extremely poor choice for a fixed income couple with nobody in your area able to work on them. I have no local LR mechanics in my area who have testbook or the equivalent and I will be buying something like rovacom (~$500USD-~$1000) probably soon. Also I probably also should install an EAS emergency kit of some kind (again $500-$1000), prob should upgrade my airsprings to Gen3s (~$1000 USD), etc. Understand that it will cost you many thousands and thousands of dollars to keep this vehicle going--probably more than you paid for it. Unlike something like a Honda or Toyota, which would be a wise transportation choice for you I think.

P38s are a lot like the Space Shuttle--cool to drive, takes you places that are awe inspiring, but with aging electronics and mechanicals falling apart, with repairs costing a fortune. And they're not for everyone.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
649 Posts
Mike is absolutely correct, but the decision to pack in and move to something simpler, cheaper, and more in tune with the capabilities of your local mechanics is one for you.
The only area where I'd differ slightly with Mike is that I feel that once something has been fixed properly, it stays fixed, so isn't an ongoing expense. The snag is that there are a lot of components that can need this 'single fix', BUT work through them and the 'fixing problems' costs drop to an affordable level. So that leaves just the fuel and oil to pay for!!

Practical Matters.
I can't help with the EAS Manual warning, because I don't run a coil conversion. If I understand correctly, when the conversion was done the error message was something else; this changed to 'EAS Manual' when somebody had a go at fixing the original error message.
Is that correct?
If so, can you recall what the original error message was?
If you do recall it, use it as a Search term in this Forum, then on the main site, then in Google across the web, see what responses you get and implement one of them. It probably involves wire jumpers in an ECU plug, the EAS ECU being under the front left seat.

Door Open.
This is a fault with one of the micro switches that is part of the door latch. Expensive to buy and a chinese puzzle to manipulate into place. There is a possibility it is dried grease that is causing the switch to stick, so let's try to cure that. There could be damaged wiring, so keep your eyes open as you work.
Remove the door card and the foam sound baffle (try not to damage it too much, repair with 2" masking tape if required. leave the non setting sealant in place). Use a small torch so you can see the latch, you may also be able to see it if you wind the window down and peer through the slot in the top of the door, again a small torch is helpful.
Use a can of WD 40 or similar. Fabricate a long extension tube (Screen wash tubing?) to deliver the spray directly onto the latch. Spray liberally, open and close the door several times. You don't need to lock and unlock, just open and close the door repeatedly.
In wetter climates the wiring joints can corrode, in particular the joint hidden in the lower half of the A pillar, where the wiring from the door meets the main loom.
Now I've given a clue you have some idea what to look for on the main site, and get alternative words which may give a clearer explanation, with pictures.

Cold air only at the feet.
"It appears the access tubes or whatever they are called have been trapped or caught when the replacement engine was installed " This is rubbish. All the HEVAC ducting is in the cab, there is none that can be disturbed during an engine change.
Has the dashboard ever been removed?
Alternatively, someone working behind the dash from the front, or from underneath, may have dislodged, or removed and not replaced, a section of duct. This would have been a separate issue to changing the engine.

Assuming it's a fault, not defective workmanship, this might be a distribution motor fault. Do you get an error symbol in the HEVAC screen, an open book with an exclamation mark?
With the ignition on, but the engine off, turn the blower fans right down. Next use the buttons to direct air towards the screen, face level, foot level. After pressing a button you should hear the whine of a motor and gear train quietly moving behind the centre of the dash (Actually, RH side, just below where the centre console meets the full width dash).
If you don't hear this, it's most likely to be either a failed HEVAC ECU (the display / button assembly) or a failed / stuck distribution motor flap. Read up about Blend Motors to find more words. There is a sticky at the start of the Forum topics.
The pair of blend motors are not the single distribution motor, but they are mechanically the same, and come as a set of three from the dealer.
While researching and fixing this, when you have some cold air in the car, switch to recirculation mode as this may help pull the whole car temperature down to an even level.

Wet carpet etc.
A common fault, the drain tubes are blocked. Again there will be coverage on the main site. The drain tubes go through the gearbox tunnel to exit under the car. They are roughly next to where your knees are when sat in the seat, and there is one outlet each side.
With coils you can't put the suspension on high, so run the front wheels up a pair of ramps and crawl underneath with a small torch. Look up alongside the gearbox (about where you knees are etc) to see a bulbous moulding with a narrow slot across it's hemispherical face. Make a long arm to reach up past the gearbox and squeeze the moulding with finger and thumb. Massage it, you will get dirt and water running down your arm. Persevere until no more comes out, then move across, reach up the other side of the gearbox, and do the other one.

If the car is going into the shop you may be able to ask a mechanic to do this, especially if they put the car on the ramp.
Expect swear words as he gets wet and dirty.

Starter motor fail.
Note that the V8 has a history of the engine earth lead corroding where the lug is crimped on the cable, specifically at the engine block end. Use a jump lead from the battery negative terminal to the engine block. If the starter motor now spins up nicely it's a cable fault, not a motor fault.

Good Luck.
 

·
Registered
2002-2005 Range Rover MkIII / L322
Joined
·
388 Posts
Just gone through the thread.Ohhhh wow, please send your phone number and I'll give you a call. If you like. Regards Russell.
 

·
Registered
2002-2005 Range Rover MkIII / L322
Joined
·
388 Posts
Just a dirty battery cable :doh: :doh: What a pain :crybaby2:
 
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
Top