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1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi

I have still not managed to solve the problems on my three cars
- I have RAVE and I've read the stickies, following a wiring diagram is not easy

1. The 96 model I can live with, it won't swing when I turn the key
There is no earth/negative power on the relay pin 85 on the fusebox for starter relay (16), in other words it does not click when I turn the key to start
Solution - take a negative wire from the battery to a button in the car and to pin 85, press it to start
What would cause this? Faulty fusebox?
PS This one is on coils, I hate it, can't lift to launch boat and it and it rolls in corners
will be going back to EAS soon, hope bags will fit easily again, I have the parts and pipes are still there

2. 98 model not electrical problem, blew a head gasket, replaced it, now it makes clouds of white smoke
looks like a leak in the intake manifold. I blocked the two small pipes on the front and it made no difference
any comments welcome before I open it up again

3. The 99 model problem really bugs me as it is my toy and my boat launcher, with manual EAS switches
I lift the back and drop the front to angle the trailer, very handy

One morning I turn the key and no EAS lights nor HEVAC display, only dash lights, swings but won't start
Also the ABS pump does not pressurize
RSW software cannot connect, it says ignition not on
Connect a negative wire to pin 85 and the EAS and HEVAC lights and ABS works
Still no spark and software says ignition is not on

I unplugged the fusebox connectors 1 by 1 and found if I remove the brown connector, C0571, the above does not work, so something to do with this
The thick black wire and the thick purple/green wire are both negative - checked with multi meter
I tried the fusebox from the 98 car, no change
All the 4 pin relays I have worked on before has + Positive on pin 30 from battery, this one is - Negative
I discovered that a 5 pin relay swops the current from pin 30 from either pin 87 to 87a and back, like a 2-way switch
Pin 30 on the fusebox is Negative, so when the relay is powered it swops the Negative between 87 and 87a
I also discovered that the ignition relay 15 has no Negative power on the fusebox, both pins 85 and 86 are positive
Volt meter from 85 and 86 to negative on battery are both the same, 14.5 volts (battery on charge)
Weird, the relay never clicks to complete the circuit when I turn the key
So no power to the coils for a spark

Now I am stuck, how does pin 85 get Negative to power the relay??? Same problem with another fusebox
Rave shows that the B and the PLG wires are Negative/earth
Somehow turning the key needs to make pin 85 go negative
Please help, I am a two hour drive from nearest LR help, and can't get the car there
I also don't want to import parts without knowing what the problem is - one UK pound or US $ = about 3 beers in South Africa, without all the postage and tax!

Thanks
William
 

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Super Moderator
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William, the last one is a problem I have found in the past. The ignition switched feed for the HEVAC and EAS display comes from an ouput on the back of the BeCM. It is the only connector that is visible from the rear passenger footwell (usually lurking under the carpet), the feed overheats and burns the contact. Check there first. Not sure if it would affect starting but it will the EAS.
 

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1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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125 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Oh WOW, thanks, will have a look
I suspect that might be the cause of the software saying ignition NOT ON
It might also provide power to the coils via the ignition relay as that relay powers the EAS and HEVAC lights too
 

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In the future please stick to one vehicle per topic. This is going to turn into a zoo with different people responding on different year rigs.
 

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LEGACY VENDOR
1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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I'll have a look in more detail tomorrow once I get home hopefully - but the ones with fusebox/electrical issues - it's worth checking the continuity on the wire from the ignition switch to the BECM for position I and II as I've seen these have a break in them a few times now which then causes things to drop out and ignition relays to now power up properly.If I think of anything else once I've had a better look tomorrow, I'll add more!**EDIT** I don't know why my line breaks aren't showing up anymore - This wasn't just one big jumble when I wrote it, honest!
 

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Sorry Marty. See the general chatter post on the failed server migration. Be sure to send ADMIN a PM that you too have no carriage returns. Are you also having issues with seeing pictures and not able to open PDF files?
 

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LEGACY VENDOR
1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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Ah - I hadn't caught up on all of that! Been busy lately, and on holiday last week so have barely even had the laptop on! I have had issues with not seeing pictures, now you mention it and I've had a couple of PM's asking me about my latch test PDF file that other people can't open - but I haven't tried it myself. I'll check out the General Chatter section and drop a PM to admin tomorrow once I'm back home properly! Cheers!
 

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1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks Marty
Will look again at pin 9, output, on C1276
It seems to supply the missing power to EAS lights, HEVAC lights, ABS etc
Without that my RSW software cannot connect, it says the ignition is not on

PS my daughter and husband recently relocated to Sholden in Kent, they want me to join them
Lots of spares in UK
William
 

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LEGACY VENDOR
1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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Pin 9 on C1276 is the power to the stop lamp switch, and comes from fuse F17 (10A). This should have 12V on it when the ignition is in Position II or III. Pin 8 on C1276 - also a white wire - is the feed INTO the BECM from the ignition switch when the key is in position II or III. This should have a connection to GROUND when the ignition switch is on. If it doesn't, then there's a problem in that wire between the ignition switch and BECM. If you DO get a connection to ground when the ignition is turned to pos II then the issue is somewhere downstream, and most likely in the BECM on the power board - either a bad connection or broken track (which are generally fixable/bypassable). It could also be a bad relay in the BECM - but they are pretty reliable - a broken track would be more likely. The ignition relay in the underbonnet fuse box also gets a GROUND from the BECM when the ignition is turned to Pos II/III and this comes out of pin 9 of C1281, and then grounds the coil on RL15 in the underbonnet fuse box... I'd start by checking the ignition feed into/out of the BECM.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
WOW Marty, that is an incredibly helpful answer, where did you get your knowledge !!
I do have some queries though
My RAVE states that pin 9 on C1276 is output to brakes, PAS (power assisted steering?), air-suspension switches and ATC ECU (auto temp control?)
When I turn the key, my dash lights come on, but not the EAS or ATC lights and the ABS pump does not prime
If I jump a ground wire to the ignition relay, then the above lights come on and ABS primes, but no spark from coils
Based on your reply I should check the ground on pin 9 on C1281 first
Thank you VERY much for the info - PS I have the same bull bar and spotlights on mine
C1276 b.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Unable to load photos
Pin 8, the white wire on C0571, brown on fusebox, does not appear to be an earth wire when ignition is switched on
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Please excuse another question
"The ignition relay in the under bonnet fuse box also gets a GROUND from the BECM when the ignition is turned to Pos II/III and this comes out of pin 9 of C1281, and then grounds the coil on RL15 in the under bonnet fuse box... I'd start by checking the ignition feed into/out of the BECM."

If I check pin 9 for ground and it is not, what will happen if I touch a ground wire to it?
If it powers the relay then fault is from ignition to BECM

If it is ground, then what will happen if I touch ground to the white wire on the brown connector on fusebox?
If it works it could be a break in that wire

I appears that you are saying, the white wire on pin 9 of C1281 is the same white wire in the brown connector C0571
I so badly want the car to start
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Marty
I just saw that pin 9 of C1281, white wire goes to pin 8 on C0575 on the fusebox, purple connector, if I remember correctly, NOT the brown one
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Marty
Using my volt meter on a setting where if you touch red and black it reads zero if it is the same wire and 1 if not the same wire
I unplugged C1281 and from pin 9 to pin 8 on C0575 it reads 1, so not the same wire or wire is broken
So if I touch earth to pin 8 on C0575 relay 15 should click?
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I can't edit previous messages
I think the volt meter setting is ohms, I set in on 20K
With ignition off pin 9 is 1 when on reads 2.79 on C1281
With ignition ON
On the 1999 broken car I test pin 8 on C0575 and it reads 1
If I test my 1996 car it reads 2.9

I could whatsapp you - my number is +27834442626
 

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@William_RR No doubt Marty will be along to follow up with you but FYI I expect he was anticipating you'd measure the various points with your multimeter set to DC volts - most meters have a 20V range that would nicely suffice.

A 'ground' would typically measure close to 0 volts with the negative (black) lead of the meter connected to the negative of the battery or body earth and the positive lead connected to the output/connection of interest. Any reasonable voltage at this point would suggest it's not grounded. In most cases you can leave the negative lead connected to the body/battery -ve and just use the positive lead to check various points.

With regard to your other question; I suppose I'd expect the BECM pinouts to be open collector, in which case you could ground a line that should otherwise be grounded without affecting the BECM. However I stress that I've not seen any schematic for it, nor messed with it to any degree, therefore I'd wait for Marty or some else who has done the sort of specific thing you want to do, and who would be able to confirm it won't harm anything (or otherwise!).
 

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Discussion Starter #17
MARTY
Thanks a lot, your posting solved the problem
I bypassed the white wire from pin 9 on C1281 of the BECM to pin 8 on the purple C0575 on the fusebox
Turned the key and it started immediately, must have had a break in it
BIG SMILES TO YOU!!!
 

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Discussion Starter #18
The white wire is NOT earthed, the BECM passes the earth to it when you turn the key, otherwise ignition stays on
All sorted now, turn the key, BECM passes earth to the purple plug on fusebox and then into negative pin of relay 15 and car starts

William
 

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LEGACY VENDOR
1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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Sorry, I was at work yesterday, and didn't get on the forum as I got home late!

Glad that it is all fixed now - it's not the first time that I've seen/heard of a broken wire in the loom... usually it's between the ignition switch and the BECM - but on yours it looks like it was between the BECM and the fuse box.

Glad it's all up and running and happy rovering!
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Thanks a lot Marty
I saw on the wiring diagram that the white earth wire goes to pin 8 on the purple plug on fusebox
So stuck a needle into both ends of the wire and saw there was no continuity
Touched a wire from needle to needle and lights came and ABS came on, turned the key and it started
Simple thanks to your knowledge and help
Now I know a bit about wiring diagrams too
 
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