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Discussion Starter #1
Having rebuilt valvle block, compressor recently my system has decided to leak...from where is the question.

Several 'soapings' and no closer to finding the culprit. Have checked all lines, fittings/junctions etc. All the valvle block and others have been added with a dab of grease just in case.

As part of troubleshooting, removed eas and tested pressure, both at the eas connector and via a gauge in line. Both show VERY low (ie negligible pressure) indicating a leak...where is the question.
WIth the compressor running is there an indication on what a good compressor should output (to the block) ? Mine shows 40psi which seems to indicate its insufficient.

WIth the EAS disconnected (but relay in), left the car overnight to find RHS front and REAR have dropped marginally indicating a leak...which I cannot seem to track down.

Any ideas greatly appreciated.
 

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Do you have the EARTh module (or similar) such as seen at below link.

http://www.rover-renovations.com/Emerge ... /earth.htm

If so, this can be a great troubleshooting tool as illustrated below:

Don't forget to spray soapy water on your gauge and gauge fittings too. They do leak, even when new. Ask me, I'll tell you all about it.


1) Hook up earth to air spring lines and bring wheel wells up to 32". Check in the morning and measure again (note, driving can actually cause corners to raise with earth in place due to thermal expansion of air when compressed...so do this when you can just leave it). If any corners have dropped, you have a leak in either that spring or line to it. Trace and fix.

2) Hook up one earth port to your tank line (#6) coming off valve block. 6mm also. Using your shop compressor, nailer compressor, etc...put about 100 to 120 psi into the tank. If you have checked your gauge for leaks already, go ahead and put it into the mix if you want with a push to connect T (like what comes with the earth). Personally, I use a tire gauge that goes to 200psi and check pressure at the earth's schrader valve itself (gauge shy and I like to eliminate all other possible points of leaks like T's). Does your pressure drop after sitting awhile? If yes, you have a leak in your tank or tank air line. Most likely the orings at the tank connection or in the line where it gets close to the exhaust. To determine if it is tank or line, you can take a small piece of extra tubing and attach one end to earth and other end direct to tank, eliminating the air line #6 from the mix. If it leaks now, it is the tank (or tank and line).

If you don't have leaks at any airsprings or their lines....and no leak at the tank or tank line, then there most be a leak in your valve block someplace or something is manfunctioning electrically. All other things have been eliminated.

That is what I did to find my leaks recently. It took a valve block rebuild and new tank line to fix it but at least I knew exactly where the leaks were. Last night after pulling in, I read 140 psi. This morning...yep, 140 :lol:
 

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Regarding your question on compressor output.

Don't be concerned with actual pressure at the compressor exhaust so much. But rather can your compressor bring your tank psi up to 150 (or close to it) or not. If so, it should be able to do it within 10 minutes, give or take from tank being empty and ecu unplugged or door open (so compressor is not trying to fill airsprings and tank at same time).

If your compressor can't get your tank up to 150psi, it needs to be rebuilt or just plain replaced. HOWEVER, if it is your diaphram that is bad (which you should have inspected while rebuilding your valve block) then your compressor won't be able to fill your tank as air is diverted out exhaust (I believe). In this case, your compressor won't pass the tank psi test but it won't be it's fault.
 

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dougs post notwithstanding, it sounds like your compressor is suspect. you should get similar pressure to what doug gets in 10 minutes or less. good luck with your search. thanks for a good explanation doug.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
thanks

Thanks all, yes when I rebuilt I checked the diaphram, and was as good as new. The compressor does sound kinda 'weak' when I think about it...not the usual robust growl :) ITs definitely not able to get the tank upto required pressure.

Will run the tests and also swap an old rebuilt compressor I have (if only I can find it). Will eliminate as suggested to test.

I do have a bypass system in place with a couple of gauges (yes I tested the backs of the gauges for leaks too)

I also plan to clean/remove all the fittings into the airbags and replace o'rings there as well (did not do this when compressor was rebuilt or bags changed, arnotts all round)...sometime next week when I get a mo.

Will run the system without EAS connected till then....me thinks

Does anyone have a diagram or point me to one (looked in rave but did not see it) which shows the location of all the o'rings in the block ?
 

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dougburgy said:
..... your compressor won't be able to fill your tank as air is diverted out exhaust (I believe). .....
correct.



there is nothing on RAVE about rebuilding the block, according to LR it can't be done. I don't have a diagram (good idea though..) but there are full instructions on my site with photos, and on the main RR.net site as well.

I think the first thing is get the compressor working right, wether it's a leak in the tank part of the system or the comp not working right, minor leaks like you have can be tolerated for a while.

A new compressor is very quiet if you forget to tighten the blue-line, so your comp may be fine, just not enough back-pressure to put a significant load on the compressor. The easiest way to tell is open it up and look at the seal.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
shupack said:
dougburgy said:
..... your compressor won't be able to fill your tank as air is diverted out exhaust (I believe). .....
correct.
[/quote="shupack"]
If this is the case; am I correct in assuming that by removing the little silencer on side of block will show this ?

shupack said:
there is nothing on RAVE about rebuilding the block, according to LR it can't be done. I don't have a diagram (good idea though..) but there are full instructions on my site with photos, and on the main RR.net site as well.
[/quote="shupack"]
Yes, thanks for great info...this is what got me started :)

shupack said:
I think the first thing is get the compressor working right, wether it's a leak in the tank part of the system or the comp not working right, minor leaks like you have can be tolerated for a while.

A new compressor is very quiet if you forget to tighten the blue-line, so your comp may be fine, just not enough back-pressure to put a significant load on the compressor. The easiest way to tell is open it up and look at the seal.
Seal is good (new from about 6months to a year ago)

Will check the tightness of blue line...spray did not show leaks...

Thanks all (Doug, Shupack, et al) Shall report back when I get to these suggestions !
 

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rrdude said:
If this is the case; am I correct in assuming that by removing the little silencer on side of block will show this ?
yes, or a little leak spray on the silencer, if the diaphragm is leaking the silencer will bubble
 

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Perhaps a weird question, but did you by chance drive through a lot of water / offroading or so?

What occasionally happens is that the lower airline, coming out of the dryer gets flooded.... This airline has a sort of a bellow in it and if you have done some seriour offroading (or your dryer isn't working correctly), this particular line gets full of water....

If that is the problem, please also check the residu of the dryer... Also wise to put these 'balls' into the magnetron once in a couple of years, to give them a good dry themselves :)

Bye,
G

PS: Or what is also possible is that your compressor seal is damaged somehow ... replacement is the only cure then...
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Update

After numerous attempts at tracking the mystery leak down the leak in front suddenly got worse and just was spewing. Quick investigation showed leak to be from where the join is at the top above the band.

I am running gen2's on the front. I confirmed this by removing the wheel and getting better access to the bag with car up high.

Contacted Arnott Industries as I remember I had purchased the gen2's direct from them. Even though I do not easily have access to any of the paperwork (as I am away at the moment) nor had any firm dates on when I had purchased these; this was no problem for Arnotts who went through their paperwork to find my original order and tell ME when I had got them.

When I initially bought mine the gen3's were just released so I was not game to 'test' them out. Considering I am at the bleeding edge of a lot of stuff this was unusual for me :) However now that they have been in the field a few years it looks like its time to give them a go. How does this affect me you ask. .... Arnotts have also kindly allowed me to upgrade the gen2's to gen3's for a small fee. A couple of days later, I think my replacement bags are on the way to this part of the world.

Now I'd challenge any manufacturer to provide this level of customer service and stand behind their products.

Guess with the exception of the folks at Donnelly, Arnott Industries are to be commended. Now if only Donnely and Arnotts could get together and by LR back...hmmmm.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Just a quick update

After a few shipping issues, the gen iii's made there way safely to this part of the world a couple of weeks ago.

I pulled the bags out this evening and installed new bags...was relatively strightforward with the hardest part to get the clips back in. Would be neat if the arnotts kit had new clips..luckily I had some floating around so was able to get them back in. It took 1hour to put clips in/out nd about 30minutes to do the rest. Hence total time about 1.5hrs to replace two front bags...prob could be done faster if more stuff was removed..but I did not even remove the liners.

Only a very short drive back but it rides real nice (prob clouded a tad by running on bump stops all this while) :)

Had a good look at the RHS bag which was leaking and the 'band' has moved significantly in one area leving a much larger 'gap' where it 'joins' the top part. This prob accounts for the leaking on that side. The bag on the LHS has the band with the same width all around.

I will do some testing over the next few weeks when I get the time.

The pump seems to be struggling to get upto pressure etc...so will investigate the seal etc when I next get a chance. I replaced this sometime last year but prob best to verify given the symptoms.

Unfortunately did not take camera and given the mess my hands were in I dare not take my phone out to take pics :)

hth someone else.
 
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