[apiske148]

Hello I am new to the Land Rover world and thus to this forum as well. I have searched and read many threads but looking for some help/clarification... I bought the vehicle in the current state so I apologize for the lack of background. The battery was completely dead, the prev. owner said it stalled out on him and he had it towed home and left it to sit for several months before he charged the battery - no luck so now I have it! Put in a new battery, truck cranks fine but wont turn over. Put a code reader on with no seen codes (not sure if they would still be there after sitting). Message centre just shows windows/sunroof not set messages. I am thinking its the immobilizer based on what I have read. Is there any way to confirm this without me buying a blackbox? the red leds on both sides of the instrument cluster blink in a seeming pattern (do i need to take note/mention this code/pattern?) Any other Ideas as to why it wont turn over?
Fuel system is getting plenty of pressure on the rail, can also hear pump prime, I will pull plugs in the morning ensure they are getting spark. Any help would be great.

Thanks.

If I do need a blackbox where is the best place to get them (Im in the US) found them on the manufactures website and a foreign ebay listing, anywhere else?

 

[apiske148]

well added reading shows that the alarm would kill the fuel pump and spark if this is accurate sounds like I have another issue... The keys have not been programmed would this factor in?

 

[John W]

Hello I am new to the Land Rover world and thus to this forum as well. I have searched and read many threads but looking for some help/clarification... I bought the vehicle in the current state so I apologize for the lack of background. The battery was completely dead, the prev. owner said it stalled out on him and he had it towed home and left it to sit for several months before he charged the battery - no luck so now I have it! Put in a new battery, truck cranks fine but wont turn over. Put a code reader on with no seen codes (not sure if they would still be there after sitting). Message centre just shows windows/sunroof not set messages. I am thinking its the immobilizer based on what I have read. Is there any way to confirm this without me buying a blackbox? the red leds on both sides of the instrument cluster blink in a seeming pattern (do i need to take note/mention this code/pattern?) Any other Ideas as to why it wont turn over?
Fuel system is getting plenty of pressure on the rail, can also hear pump prime, I will pull plugs in the morning ensure they are getting spark. Any help would be great.

Thanks.

If I do need a blackbox where is the best place to get them (Im in the US) found them on the manufactures website and a foreign ebay listing, anywhere else?

First of all the problem wasnt the battery,as the vehicles motor obviously failed on him for some reason and this problem still exists.
When you say it cranks but wont turn over,I presume you mean that the starter motor rotates which in turn rotates the engine crankshaft, but the engine does not fire and become self sustaining.(Cranks and turns over mean the same thing).
As you are not getting an "Engine immobilised" message on the message centre it might not be immobiliser related.
I suspect it could be the Crankshaft sensor,so I would start there.

 

[apiske148]

First of all the problem wasnt the battery,as the vehicles motor obviously failed on him for some reason and this problem still exists.
When you say it cranks but wont turn over,I presume you mean that the starter motor rotates which in turn rotates the engine crankshaft, but the engine does not fire and become self sustaining.(Cranks and turns over mean the same thing).
As you are not getting an "Engine immobilised" message on the message centre it might not be immobiliser related.
I suspect it could be the Crankshaft sensor,so I would start there.

Correct the motor turns but does not fire. I planned on checking sensors in the morning but was hoping for input as to where to look. i know for my toyota's and motorcycles there are posts online of PDF versions of service manuals that are free is that the case with range rovers? I am downloading a rave cd I found to see what all is listed there. I am also going to check fuses/relays any thoughts as to which ones in particular while fuses are obvious when dead relays are not...

 

[John W]

Rave is all the manual you will need.Takes a bit of time to get used to navigating around it,but has all the info you might need.Good Luck

 

[apiske148]

just confirmed that i am getting spark, have not checked the crankshaft sensor due to not finding it yet, though i am now questioning if i am getting enough fuel pressure

 

[apiske148]

fuel system checks out getting plenty of pressure while trying to start, pulled the crankshaft position sensor and it appears to be fine, it was not bent or broken and is reading at 1.26ohms which is in range i understand. It was a bit oily it that means anything.... any other suggestions?

 

[diff]

It might be worth a dribble of fuel on the intake side to see if that spark can do something with it. When my van fuel pump died one of the checks was to spray a shot of ether in the intake which allowed engine to fire. Only try this if you know about it!! good luck.

 

[apiske148]

I have not tried spraying starter fluid down the intake yet, I ordered a new Crankshaft Position Sensor once that is installed i am going to drain the tank put in fresh fuel with an additive and see what that does... (trying to eliminate as many variables as possible)

 

[Mrmerlin]

quick test is to spray some ether into the intake a 2 second spray should be good then try to start the truck is if tries to start then you have fuel issue if you dont get any fire then you need to take out the plugs and do a compression test.
If the plugs are wet with fuel and you have compression put in a new set of plugs.
If plugs are dry and you have compression then you have fueling issue
if plugs are wet and you have spark but no compression then you have a damaged cam or timing chain

 

[big-t]

You may want to check to see if you're getting a signal to your injectors. Put a test light on the contacts on the injector plug and crank it over to see if your getting a pulse. :think:

 

[apiske148]

unfortunately my compression tester is broken I am looking for a replacement... plugs looked fine though i think one was wet I will have to double check, I will test the injector signal once the weather clears another good idea. I hope to be getting in the crankshaft sensor any day now to eliminate that variable as well.

thanks for the help! keep the ideas coming

 

[apiske148]

installed the new crankshaft position sensor and I am hopeful, also drained the fuel and put in 5gal of fresh with seafoam. still not starting but now it sounds like its trying to fire every couple turns going to let it sit over night to let everything dry out (let it crank for awhile) hoping i just flooded it and good things will happen in the morning! at one point while I was trying to start it I got an ABS error horn honked and lights flashed when I tried to start it, pulled the negative bat cable reinstalled and it went away... any ideas as to what this was?

 

[knaph01]

ABS error and Traction Fault (also Window Not Set and Gearbox Fault) usually stem from a poor battery/alternator. Why this car cant tell you that the voltage is low or the charge rate is poor is one of the abiding mysteries of British (sorry BMW) engineering. It scared the living daylights out of me last year when the alternator stopped putting out enough electricity. A quick trip to an auto electrician to replace the diode on the back of the alternator fixed it up for me. Good luck with the starting - my car had the same problem that in my case was the crank position sensor and low fuel pressure. Ended up replacing the sensor and the fuel pump (the filter is integrated into the pump on later cars).

 

[apiske148]

well i am assuming (hoping) fuel pressure is not the issue at this point. While I do not have a fuel pressure gauge if I press the schrader valve while it is cranking the fuel literally shoots several feet so based on that I feel like pressure is fine. though I would like to get my hands on a gauge just to make sure. Am I correct in saying the pressure is suppose to be 35psi? It really sounds like it is trying to start now where as before it was just cranking and cranking, now every 4-6 turns it seems to put a little and then just continue to turn via the starter.... I am hoping to get help so i can test compression/fuel pressure (its been a one man operation so far, and both of these require two ppl)

 

[apiske148]

fuel isnt the issue... I am getting 40psi to the fuel rail, pulled the plugs and they are wet... back to the drawing board...

 

[apiske148]

put in new plugs... now its sounds like its firing intermittently like its trying to run on its own but just cant... its puttering but not self sufficient! the wires on it are aftermarket and appear to be fine, i dont want to just keep replacing things hoping they are the problem, it sounds SO close though someone has to have a new idea or what im missing

 

[TerryY]

If the plugs keep getting wet--pull the fuse to the fuel pump and try to start it that way. If it pops off it should run long enough to dry out the cylinders and warm the plugs up a bit. When it quits put the fuse back in and start it again.

My first BMW V8 was good at flooding itself into submission with Bosch Platinum Plus spark plugs. If you moved it once to wash it and then shut it off, Moved it back into the garage and shut it off again you were guaranteed a no start the next time you tried. It would wet all the plugs on cold start enrichment and about the only way to restart it was pull the fuel pump fuse so it couldn't wet itself again. Same control system there as the Bosch Rovers.

 

[apiske148]

well problem solved! after continued attempts to start it finally began to run on its own, it it slow to start each time and takes it a minute to reach a smooth idle but I figure the ECU has to relearn things having sat for 6 months.... Thanks for all the help and input. For those just now reading solution was: new crankshaft position sensor and new set of plugs, and new battery

 

[John W]

well problem solved! after continued attempts to start it finally began to run on its own, it it slow to start each time and takes it a minute to reach a smooth idle but I figure the ECU has to relearn things having sat for 6 months.... Thanks for all the help and input. For those just now reading solution was: new crankshaft position sensor and new set of plugs, and new battery

Congrats on getting up and going.Run it for a few hundred miles and see if it settles down.If not it would be worthwhile cleaning the MAF. :thumb: