Colin has been very quiet recently.
I apologize to everyone for my recent non participation on the board, but i do have my reasons.
I also unreservedly apologize for what now seems to have become a public squabble on this fine forum, it is was not my idea or intent, i did not initiate it and have done my best to ignore it, not provoke it or encourage it in any way.
However, under the circumstances of this particular post, which obviously seems to now have ever growing direct aspects, including quotes from E-Mails i have decided that it is best to now add my input only because i am sure many expect a response, are wondering why there is not one from me and perhaps some might might even appreciate reading my direct communications to Mike and the responses in full, rather than part.
It is a sad fact of any business no matter how well intended that you are always bound to encounter dissatisfied customers for whatever reason at some point, It is very easy to allow ones self to be provoked into entering into non productive argument. It is however more important than any other desire to remain professional and courteous at all times, It is after all how you handle the more difficult aspects that truly sets one apart.
I believe that i have, as you will read and judge for yourself, courteously attempted to explain to Mike the reasoning behind all of his points, I have offered him an unconditional refund should he desire and pointed out the mis understanding he has had in respect of his missing our instructions to now perform a vehicle scan and send us the results, without which we have no way of knowing anything about his specific vehicle and thus cannot issue any codes.
I really do not know what more i can do to appease Mike, we do the best we can under now ever more trying circumstances than ever, and i will now continue to refrain from comment, especially on a post which really does this fine forum no justice or favours at all regardless of provocation. I can but only hope that readers will understand my reasoning and motives.
I would however add that i have always regarded this forum with the highest esteem, i would never do or post anything that would lower the tone and consider them lucky to have a guy like Ron holding the reins who has personally taught me quite a lot, and i thank you all for your understanding and support.
My warmest regards to all, Including Mike
Colin
Copy of Mails as promised below
--- On Tue, 7/21/09, BBS Admin - Colin wrote:
From: BBS Admin
Subject: Re Quotation amendment
To: mikeXXXXXXXXX
Date: Tuesday, July 21, 2009, 2:32 AM
Dear Mike
Following your recent comments of complaint on Range Rovers.net forum, which i might humbly suggest might have been better handled and conveyed with a simple e-mail or PM to me, i have looked into the matter.
You are indeed correct that the administration fee is not applicable in the circumstance of upgrade from FCO SV to Full SV, and I can but only apologize for the oversight on the two quotations previously given to you, there was certainly no meaningful intent to "bend you over" and i am sure that should you have proceeded with the update that the matter would have been picked up by one of the more senior Admin staff. In fact our Admin staff are usually very highly commended.
So to correct,
To upgrade from FCO SV to Full SV (MP033 to MP011) during the July discount period will be $464.97 and there after $652.33
Regards Credit Card Surcharges,
Credit card merchants have long been very wary of any and all overseas mail order over internet transactions which understandably have a very high level of fraud rate, for this reason they charge much higher than expected rates to cover such transactions.
In our case the rate we are charged is 5% of the total transaction amount. It seems that Banks and money transactions are fast becoming a world wide problem for us all.
I hope that you would appreciate that our profit margin is already so low on our equipment, that we simply cannot suffer this additional loss and so do the best we can which is compromise by splitting it and paying some ourselves.
You will have noticed, that the goods are shipped with an invoice related only to the hardware, you will in due course also receive a separate invoice by E-mail for the software element that will add up to your total invoice value.
By doing this we do indeed help many customers in places where duties or VAT are a substantial factor although i appreciate that this may well not be applicable to you.
However other than helping out our customers in less fortunate locations there is another benefit to our doing this, in the form of a reduced value of goods in transit which requires less insurance and therefore lowers the cost of shipping some.
This does however mean that the system has to be shipped de activated, and to combat possible fraud or theft in transit the activation codes released only when the genuine and authenticated recipient acknowledges safe arrival.
I appreciate that you may well not understand the logic and reasoning behind this procedural requirement but it is there non the less.
Furthermore, I would hope that you would be able to appreciate that the only possible way for us to know and obtain the required information to correctly activate all the right software modules for your any specific vehicle we do require the connection of our hardware and the running of some special scan software followed by the sending to us of the results,
again with the best will in the world, this simply cannot be done until the other steps have been completed. This therefore does take some time.
Sadly your comments seem to elicit a degree of mis understanding, mistrust and impatience in us and our equipment that i quite firmly believe will not be conducive to a good experience with your equipment.
Before proceeding any further therefore, I would like to offer you this opportunity to return your equipment for a full and immediate refund.
I await your response.
cordially yours
Colin Whittall.
Hi Colin,
There is nothing on RR.net that I posted that isn't true. I have written a completely unbiased view of things from your customers prospective.
"So to correct,
To upgrade from FCO SV to Full SV (MP033 to MP011) during the July discount period will be $464.97 and there after $652.33"
How is this price any different then the price I got quoted and posted on RR.net other then you rolled the admin fee into the total. I checked the price I got quoted twice to ensure accuracy. The follow up email I recieved stated the price was correct. This email I just recieved from you also confirms the price I recieved is also correct. I dont want to argue about price your fully able to charge whatever you want. But just for sake of argument sv120=1248.11 sv320=666.89 1248.11-666.89=$581.22 This would be inline with what I would expect to pay for an upgrade. Which would basically be the price I got quoted minus the admin fee. Your customers should not have to check with Colin to get an accurate quote.
Regarding credit card surcharges. In the US companies also pay a 3% CC surcharges. Visa makes a percentage of your sale for the convienence of giving the company another way to collect payment for which if it didn't exist the sale may have never occured. In the US companies are NOT allowed to pass these charges onto the consumer. As far as you paying an extra 2% because of international scams. Can you see how this isn't anyone in the US's problem? We have our own scum bags to deal with why should we be faced to pay more for someone else's. Paying with CC exspecially for international orders is what most American's are going to feel comforitable with. It provides you added security. If the the merchant falls short on promised goods Visa refunds 100% of the costs. They then resolve getting the money back from the merchant to pay themselves back. I dont know how things work over there. My CC company did call me and I had to authorize this transaction .You have to look at things from your US customers point of view. We are not used to paying these fees so you have to also understand it doesn't make us happy. No where on RR.net did I say I got bent over for this CC surcharge. I wasn't happy about it but I accepted it. Someone in the US looking to order from you might find the post benificial in that it shows real costs to get the item to their door.
As for the reciept. Seems to me what you are doing is illegal. But I'm not a lawyer either and don't intend to judge you on what I don't know. As far as I know no one in the US pays taxes on web based transactions. You ship both hardware and software together so it seems rather fishy to me.
As for activation you have to also look at things from your cutomers point of view. What benifit does activation give your customer? None, this is soley benificial to your company this ensures your companies intellectual property is protected. Now imagine buying a $1000 computer and Microsoft tells you sorry you can't use it until we get around to activating it? And by the way we are on a completely different time zone then you and we only have one person giving out activation codes and we only work M-F 8-5 and not on holidays. Now you must sit back and weight for someone else to get around to making your paper weight work. I imagine you wouldn't be to happy about it either. Your activation process is less then desired. You
really should have an automated system here. One in which someone can read the codes from their vehicle submit them to a server on your side from the equipment software and recieve the codes back. At least for the basic features.
I've read your forum and from what I understand you have one person doing activation. This makes the waiting all that much more fun!
I've tried to keep my posts on RR.net completely unbiased and only report exactly what my costs and experiences are. Maybe instead of look at things from an owner perspective you should try switching seats and look at what your cutomers put up with to own your product. Not every company would be able to operate the way you do. I do however think its great that you guys have over the years produced a lower cost unit that an average person would be willing to purchase and provided an upgrade path for the feature. These are key selling points.
From here we'll see how things go. I'd like to say what I think of the product but I still can't use it.
--- On Wed, 7/22/09, BBS Admin - Colin wrote:
From: BBS Admin
Subject: Re: Re Quotation amendment
To: "Mike"
Date: Wednesday, July 22, 2009, 1:07 AM
Thank you for your comments.
For absolute clarity, can you simply confirm that by stating "From here we'll see how things go" you are declining my offer of refund at this time, yes or no, in which case, i shall not intervene with the normal procedure.
regards
Colin
Colin,
Do you withhold activation codes from people that don't rave about your product? I paid fully for a product I expect to get what I paid for. If I wasn't happy with your product I wouldn't waste my time returning it I would sell it to whoever would be willing to pay for it and move on.
Simply put how can I make a decision to return a product you have never fully delivered!
-Mike
Hiya Mike
No of course we do not withold codes to anyone for any reason, based on your comments thus far, i merely offered you the refund option from common courtesy.
As i have said before "Sadly your comments seem to elicit a degree of mis understanding,"
In your latest comments on RR.net You seem to be under the impression that it is we that need to send you some codes, however as explained by the text on the final page of the registration process, and in the confirmation mail sent out Monday and in the mail i sent you (second paragraph from last), we clearly stated that we now require you to perform a vehicle scan and send us the results so we know what codes to issue you for your vehicle. Without this we have no way to know what systems are fitted to your car and what codes to issue.
I am sorry if you missed that, and i can but hope that this clears up the procedural confusion.
Regards
Colin
copy of confirmation mail below
"Dear Mike,
Thank you for activating your owner's account. You may now log in with the new username and password that you have selected at
http://www.blackbox-solutions.com/support/
It may be necessary to adjust your firewall/security settings if the page cannot be displayed correctly.
Here you can gain access to the online forums which is our method of providing technical support, the latest versions of the software, other downloads and your personal TUP codes should any be available.
A vehicle scan is required to be carried out and then processed to enable TUP codes to be released.
Please retain a copy of this for future reference.
Regards
"Blackbox Solutions"
