RangeRovers.net Forum banner

1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
11 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
'99 Callaway Editiion RR has recently begun revving about 500 to 750 rpm before it shifts from 3rd gear into Drive. All other shifts apppear to be normal. This same problem occurs when the transmission is being manually shifted from 3rd to Drive, again it does not happen with any other change of gears. We just had a engine tune up/plugs/etc done, as well as other repairs since owning the car for just 3 months, but this is the first time any transmission troubles have arose.

The transmission fluid has been drained, checked and strained and found to be perfect. We plan to take this to a RR dealer to check for any codes that may be stored in the Gems System (the import shop where most work has been done doesn't have the software). There is no engine or tranny icon lighting up on the dashboard display. We welcome your comments and suggestions. This vehicle has 61,095 miles on it and is in concurs condition otherwise.
 

·
Registered
2002-2005 Range Rover MkIII / L322
Joined
·
388 Posts
galenpriv said:
'99 Callaway Editiion RR has recently begun revving about 500 to 750 rpm before it shifts from 3rd gear into Drive. All other shifts apppear to be normal. This same problem occurs when the transmission is being manually shifted from 3rd to Drive, again it does not happen with any other change of gears. We just had a engine tune up/plugs/etc done, as well as other repairs since owning the car for just 3 months, but this is the first time any transmission troubles have arose.

The transmission fluid has been drained, checked and strained and found to be perfect. We plan to take this to a RR dealer to check for any codes that may be stored in the Gems System (the import shop where most work has been done doesn't have the software). There is no engine or tranny icon lighting up on the dashboard display. We welcome your comments and suggestions. This vehicle has 61,095 miles on it and is in concurs condition otherwise.
Mmmmmm strange, maybe check all connections to engine ecu and gearbox ecu also have the TPS checked. I've seen connectors that have been pulled apart to be checked and when pushed back together the connectors themselves have been forced out of the back of the plastic retainer.Regards Russell
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,036 Posts
About 6 months ago I was asked to check out a P38 Diesel with a similar problem,a very quick jump in revs as the box shifted to top gear from third.I could find nothing wrong via Testbook,and all fluid levels/condition were good.In desperation it was suggested that the ecu was at fault,another unit was tried and gave the same results.There was a fault within the autobox itself,shame was the owner wanted a 7 seat car - he traded it in without repair,so I cant give the actual cause to you......
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
As I understand it the ZF 4 gearbox has a 1st, second and reverse clutch and a third and fourth gear clutch -( or similar ). I would throw in the idea that the 3/4 gear clutch is at fault
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
We had it at the RR dealer this morning to get it checked out and apparently we need to replace the whole transmission as there were no specific codes / nothing electronically needed fixed. Any help on this matter? The dealer quoted about $3900 for the repairs, but we think it can get done for about $2000.

* Also- since I have a Callaway, is the transmission itself the same as other P38 4.6HSEs? I know the gear ratios are different but is the actual transmission the same, so I don't need for example one from another Callaway. Thanks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
226 Posts
classic stealership diagnosis, no codes therefore they have no clue, when in doubt they just replace everything, I wonder what happens if they replaced the tranny and it doesn't fix the problem
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Yeah but unfortunately there's really nothing else we can do.. And sport mode is not stuck, unfortunately!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
61 Posts
galenpriv said:
Yeah but unfortunately there's really nothing else we can do.. And sport mode is not stuck, unfortunately!
Just another thought!

You may have checked the fluid level in the gearbox BUT your car is a 1999 model, if might be one of those that doesn't have a dip stick (normally comes up in the engine bay) to check the level. A lot of garages (even Dealers) don't follow the correct procedure which should be:

Put box in N fill with oil (correct transmission fluid) until it overflows then start engine (in N) it will suck all the oil up so need to pump like crazy to top it back up until it overflows again. Put shifter in High and move the shifter up and down the gate a few times (a few seconds at each position) check level. The engine revs should now drop when you shift fron N to D - put Plug in - test drive = check level with engine running in N
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
61 Posts
stopover said:
galenpriv said:
Yeah but unfortunately there's really nothing else we can do.. And sport mode is not stuck, unfortunately!
Just another thought!

You may have checked the fluid level in the gearbox BUT your car is a 1999 model, if might be one of those that doesn't have a dip stick (normally comes up in the engine bay) to check the level. A lot of garages (even Dealers) don't follow the correct procedure which should be:

Put box in N fill with oil (correct transmission fluid) until it overflows then start engine (in N) it will suck all the oil up so need to pump like crazy to top it back up until it overflows again. Put shifter in High and move the shifter up and down the gate a few times (a few seconds at each position) check level. The engine revs should now drop when you shift fron N to D - put Plug in - test drive = check level with engine running in N
And a quote rom Ashcroft Transmissions (UK) FAQs :
"My P38 autobox has eratic and late shifts and torque converter lockup".
Answer: This is often not an autobox fault but the info being fed to the autobox ECU from the engine air flow meter. Often the diagnostics will not read any faults from the airflow meter but if you change it, it will correct the shift points and converter lockup speed.

Would be most interested in how you get on?
 

·
FOUNDING MEMBER
Joined
·
4,509 Posts
galenpriv said:
Yeah but unfortunately there's really nothing else we can do.. /quote]

take it to a transmission specialist. even without the codes (codes are only as helpfull as the engineer that programmed them...) they should be able to do it. The same transmission was used in BMW's and Audi's.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
I am at school but it is my car- i've been forwarding the replies to my dad at home with the car and here is something he thinks I should bring up to see if there is anything you can tell us:

Thank you for forwarding those email replies. They are very informative. First of all, we do have a dip stick for the tranny fluid and the level is correct. Tomorrow I am going to add some Lucas Automatic Transmission Fix to the Tranny fluid as it is supposed to stop slippage. Dan Fowler at Autotech said he used some on his vehicle (has an '04 Rover) before and it worked for a while. Maybe we will get a longer run before the inevitable.

Now the comment from the UK guys is very interesting as the Air Fow Meter is one of the items on the list of things Bobby Rahal said needed replaced. The only problem is they are not cheap (at least from Bobby Rahal.... they are $1623.47 each and the labor is one hour to put one in at $96.50 per hour of labor.)

I am thinking that we might search out the cost on these Air Flow Meters and have one put in. Ask about the Stored Diagnostic Trouble Code: P1178 (-T-) that was found. The other code that came up was P0133 (-T-). The second one is for an Oxygen sensor which probably does not impact the transmission.

* I looked online and the price for a mass airflow sensor seems to be around $150, I don't know if the dealer is off by $1500 or if I am looking at the wrong part ...
 

·
FOUNDING MEMBER
Joined
·
4,509 Posts
dealers are notorious for mis-diagnosing and significantly over-charging...but they simply operate within LR's rules.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
You need to make sure she is running right before you try and diagnose ant transmission problems. The price you have been quoted for the MAF seems a little over the top. UK price I would expect to be £150 Max. Don not pay someone to fit it if you do get one, this is a 5 min job at most, but you will need to get the ECU adaptions reset afterwards. There are a whole raft of tests you can do detailed in the Rave manual, but you will need a pressure gauge.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
640 Posts
galenpriv said:
Now the comment from the UK guys is very interesting as the Air Fow Meter is one of the items on the list of things Bobby Rahal said needed replaced. The only problem is they are not cheap (at least from Bobby Rahal.... they are $1623.47 each and the labor is one hour to put one in at $96.50 per hour of labor.)
Rewmer said:
You need to make sure she is running right before you try and diagnose ant transmission problems. The price you have been quoted for the MAF seems a little over the top. UK price I would expect to be £150 Max.
Approx current price for a Genuine L/R MAF for a Gems Engine is £750.00 + VAT and the Bosch One is £125.00 + VAT
That's UK price not sure what current Exchange Rate's are.

Cheers
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Ok, so the $1600 MAF is legitimate. The Callaway model has a different mass air flow sensor than the other Ranges, so the prices of anywhere from $100 to $300 were irrelevant. My dad went to a different dealer today and since they are getting rid of old merchandise, he got the Callaway one for $800. They said they'd only sold 5 of them since the Callaway was released, so we're hoping this works (as there was a fault code for a MAF, and after to talking to some transmission stores they said this could very well be the fix, as another Rover had the same code and after replacing a MAF their problem was solved.) He's putting it on and driving the car tonight so I will update with whether we saved ourselves a new transmission or threw $800 away ...
 

·
FOUNDING MEMBER
Joined
·
4,509 Posts
galenpriv said:
... or threw $800 away ...

even if it doesnt' fix the shifting issue, a new MAF will improve efficiency, helping the engine last longer and strech your fuel budget... it will pay for itself.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
The new mass airflow sensor was installed but did not fix the problem with the transmission. As he was leaving the dealer to get the ECU codes reset the car had some trouble starting (I forget exactly what he said when he called earlier in the week, but something has been leaking into the cylinders), which has happened on a few occasions before. In addition to needing the transmission fixed now, a head gasket job is in order too.
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top