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Discussion Starter #1
Since I think I've got a head gasket leak and the water is going out the pipe I'm going for the Crack Block liquid fix.

The factory says to remove the thermostat, which I can't due to the 38 engine design so I was looking at the Rave manual and see that the thermostat when cold stops the water flow from the radiator, but allows water to flow from the thermostat up to the water pump and out to the heater core and back to the thermostat.
When the engine is cold the water does not flow through the radiator because the thermostat is closed. The radiator doesn't get water flow until the engine gets warm and then the thermostat opens up and water can then flow out the top radiator hose and down to the lower hose to the thermostat.

Tomorrow I'm going to add the head sealer since I don't have another option except engine break down.

It says to let the engine idle for 50 minutes. The thermostat should be open by then to let the sealer enter the entire engine and the radiator.


Any ideas on success? Has anyone been through it?
 

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What makes you think you have a head gasket leak? In your other thread you said that you can run the engine with the cap off the reservoir. If you had a head gasket leak or a cracked head, doing that would cause combustion gases to be forced into the cooling system which would push out all of the coolant. Most sealants only succeed in clogging the radiator and heater matrix which cause you to have to pull it apart anyway to repair the damage done by the sealant.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I'm losing water to somewhere. Over a gallon at about 5 miles. Last night while watching the tailpipe, more smoke and fog than ever before.
The missing water and the cylinder misfire code, what else could it be?
 

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1995-2002 Range Rover P38A
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Iooooo man. I know people who have RUINED their radiators using that stuff. It seals leaks in the head gasket and also seals your radiator up to the point it is clogged and your engine then overheats. Again if your radiator is pretty old a new $200 radiator afterwards might be a good idea.
Are there any other options???
 

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JACK'S GRANDAD
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This again?
Head gaskets are an easy job on these, especially a GEMS, so there is no excuse to clog everything up with that crap.
Sounds like you're just guessing anyways, so why not follow in someone else's footsteps and do some actual testing before ruining the whole cooling system? There are good folks who have actually followed a logical procedure and come to a conclusion based on those tests vs guessing, then took the time to make a thread about it all.
Even a generic coolant test would point you in a more accurate direction than what it sound like so far.

Martin
 

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Out of panic and desperation a few years ago, I did use the liquid sealer in my car. Didn't like the results to say the least. First, the leak did not stop. Second, it did completely destroy my radiator right away. Third, the relationship cannot be proven but my heater core started leaking massively not from the usually suspect orings, but from the core tubes. My guess is that few tubes got clogged up, and flow to few remaining tubes got too fast, destroying the tubes from the inside.

I would take a deep breath, and determine the root cause to the leak first.

Then, consider the proper fix for the root cause.

If you are resorting to using something like Barsleak, I would bypass not only thermostat but radiator and heater core as well. I believe the instructions for something like Barsleak say so as well. This should be your last resort, as surely other parts will get damaged and leaks will return right away.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Blue Devil Head Gasket Sealer (Not the Pour and GO is what I picked up.

I'm losing water out the tailpipe and I'm too old to start an engine down.
 

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Heed the warnings if your P38 means anything to you. If it means nothing to you think about selling it on to someone willing to do proper repairs. Those sealing bits take into account absolutely spotless heater cores and radiators. Changing brands is not going to change the results. If you really have a failing head gasket that is breached enough you are losing coolant out the tailpipe you may be just gumming up parts of the cooling system.

How long did you have white "smoke" clouds out your tail pipe prior to losing fluid out the back?
 

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JACK'S GRANDAD
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But not too old to bodge a job apprently
 

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Discussion Starter #10
The
Heed the warnings if your P38 means anything to you. If it means nothing to you think about selling it on to someone willing to do proper repairs. Those sealing bits take into account absolutely spotless heater cores and radiators. Changing brands is not going to change the results. If you really have a failing head gasket that is breached enough you are losing coolant out the tailpipe you may be just gumming up parts of the cooling system.

How long did you have white "smoke" clouds out your tail pipe prior to losing fluid out the back?
The smoke was only noticed the day it first stalled and the red lite showed overheated and died. It took over two gallons of water after it cooled down and restarted. 5 miles to home and overheated again as we got home water gone and blew heater hose.
 

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So out of the blue, it overheated so severely that it stalled? Then you drove it another 5 miles after adding water because "it cooled"? Sadly you will most likely have far more damage now than a simple blown head gasket.

Usually folks notice white steam out the tailpipe when cold then it stops when the engine reaches temp. That lasts a while. Then you start to see the steam lasting longer, sometimes paired with misfires, then CEL due misfires getting bad enough to log codes. Then the head gasket finally fails and you are down to 6 or maybe 7 cylinders firing. Coolant is shoved out the exhaust and the engine gets hot. Now, up to this point you can still save the engine. If you keep driving it and you have no cooling the oil will try to cool the engine then the oil beaks down, fails and the engine quits.
 

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JACK'S GRANDAD
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Could well be a candidate for a liner job at this point.
That is ASSuming there was some testing done to begin with, which is doubtful from my reading.
Even a $50 sniffer test would be better than nothing.

Martin
 

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I would also suggest starting with a sniffer test to determine whether it is indeed a head gasket leak.

A tester can be had for around $50 as leftlane said from places like Napa. Extremely easy to do as well.

From what you've described up to the point you mentioned water leaving the exhaust, the symptoms you described sounded a lot like a clogged radiator.
 

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+1 on checking the system properly rather than introducing more sludge.

FYI, to answer the thread subject line, here's the water flow diagram: (I assume all 1998 are GEMS ? )

Cooling System Flow P38 GEMS.jpg
 

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JACK'S GRANDAD
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Yes, it's a GEMS without question.
 

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+1 on checking the system properly rather than introducing more sludge.

FYI, to answer the thread subject line, here's the water flow diagram: (I assume all 1998 are GEMS ? )
I thought GEMS had the thermostat fitted on the intake manifold similar to the 14 CUX, this drawing shows the thermostat as the heart valve style and at the lower hose, reminiscent to the bosh engine.
 

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JACK'S GRANDAD
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Same thermostat on all P38's. Simple part lookup would show the same.....
 

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I currently have a GEMS engine in bits because the head gasket started blowing out the side of one of the cylinders. It really doesn't take long once you get started, just get the upper plenum off, inlet manifold off, valley gasket off and that's you ready to get the heads out. Dead easy - but if you've still got the stock rocker cover bolts you'll need a deep 1/4" drive 8mm bi-hex socket to get those horrible things out! I swapped mine for little stainless Allen bolts. Start to finish it took me about an hour to get the first head off, and not much longer to get the second off since it was getting pretty late at night and the weather was getting worse.

If you've driven it until it actually stopped after overheating, it's very likely you've cracked one of the liners away and simply replacing the head gasket at this stage will not cure the problem. As others have said, you're almost certainly looking at getting the block top-hatted. But hey, you're in the US, so finding an engine shop that'll fix a 1960s pushrod V8 ought to be a doddle, right?
 
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