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2006-2009 Range Rover MkIII / L322
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Just bought it. I've put 400 miles on it with the odometer now at 110,011 miles, HSE model, I have two sets of keys. One set (both sets switchblade type) always worked the locks and ran the car. The other only ran the car, never worked the locks. I assumed it had a dead key battery. When looking into batteries for the keys I found they are rechargeable. So, I took the spare for a drive. I went here and there, (never shut the car off), then on my way home. Instruments went to zero, all the lights in the instrument cluster came on and it limped home in I'm guessing 1st gear. I parked it and now there it sits. It flashes a transmission failure message, then a tire pressure message and I think a transfer case message. Engine won't crank, but everything else comes on. I read that it could be the vehicle battery. Battery showed 12.25 vdc WITHOUT key on. I disconnected it and thoroughly cleaned the terminals. I shorted the + and – leads together while the battery was disconnected to maybe reset the ECU. When putting all back together, I found the negative and positive terminals although were snug, were not tight and in fact a little loose. I replaced these and now have tight, clean connections. Battery charged to a resting 12.86 vdc after charging all night. Still no change.


One of the battery hold down brackets has rusted away leaving the other holding on. I can move the battery back and forth with some effort. When the car went nuts, I was taking some sharp curves in the road pretty aggressively. I am wondering if that made the battery shift, making the system momentarily lose power. But, why still all the same issues? I re-synched the main key I always use and it still does as it always has, unlocked the doors. The spare however, I could not get to re-synch. I'm not so much concerned with synching keys right now as I am in just getting it running


One final word. When the key is in and the whole car switched on, I get 11.67 vdc across the battery. Is this an acceptable voltage drop? BTW, with the battery charger on the battery, charging at 12.76 volts, when I turn the key, I get a drop to 12.11. Surely, it would still crank? The battery is 3 years old.


Oh yeah, my OBDII reader won't make a connection. The reader tells me to check my connection. Do typical run of the mill OBD2 readers work on this car?


Thank you for your help. Chris
 

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Sounds like perhaps you battery shorted out against something? I am not sure there would be enough play for that to happen. Your voltage is way too low. sadly if you cant get running you cant do the electrical tests in the electrical troubleshooting stickie. first thing is to get a decent battery in the beast and go from there.
 

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2006-2009 Range Rover MkIII / L322
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Also, a long shot idea.

I have an '08 SC that exhibited similar symptoms. Even after a new battery, same wonky behavior.

After a couple of weeks in the shop (independent) turned out to be a bad ignition switch.

I had a '98 BMW 740. That model was also prone to exhibiting similar issues, and it nearly always turned out to be a bad ignition switch.

I'm NOT saying this is the diagnosis of your rig's issues, but it could be.

As the other poster pointed out, a 12V battery in good shape should read 13.4V.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
With high hopes I replaced the battery tonight with a brand new massive AGM battery. I put it on the charger for an hour before installing it. I have new terminal posts on both positive and negative. No change.


Worse yet, no link up with my OBDII reader. None of the codes flashing on the screen make sense. Tire inflation? Oil change? Transmission?


Until this incident there have been no warnings or error lights appear. Next step please.

Jerry, how does one go about narrowing down to something seemingly unrelated as the key switch? This isn't a random thing that happens. This car is stuck.
 

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Sounds like an Ignition switch problem to me. Engine won't crank but everything else turns on, instruments went to zero, OBDII reader won't link. Classic symptoms of the ignition switch not making the handshake with the computer to link and to start the car and the OBDII port? Think about it. I would tap the ignition switch with a mallet a few times and see if it works then! But that's just me. lol. But seriously, I think JerrytheK is on to something.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
According to the shop manual, there is just the key switch, some relays, fuses and the ECM that makes the engine crank and run. Right? So, it's either the ECM or the key switch.


ECM. If this went bad, I wouldn't have made it home. Right? Or would I? Would it be able to flash these random messages? Or am I seeing the 'test' flashes of all the lights at startup.


Keyswitch. If this went nutty, then why would it have let me keep driving it? Software to limp home? So, powering up the ECM doesn't necessitate the link to the OBDII port? That is initiated with the radio chip key to the transponder coil right?


There is a symptom chart in the mechanic book, but it says to check the ECM relay, starting system and harness. I'm trying to find "Starting System" in the shop manual, but it's getting late. There are a few others, but I've eliminated them. Sorry to be difficult, but throwing parts on to chase a problem messes with my ego. Or maybe that's how it's done with RRs?


I don't replace the actual keyswitch, but rather the transponder coil reads off the RF chip in the key, right? If I replace the key, then I need to re-flash or replace the ECM, and for that it's a dealer affair with title in hand.


The manual says there is a special tool for removing the keyswitch. Do you guys know if a drift punch work? Thanks for the help.
 

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If you can turn the key to the crank position and it just doesn't crank the steering column and anti theft ECU are working correctly and are not going to be your issue. If the key doesn't turn then theres a problem with the key or the steering column ECU. The wires at the bottom of your key switch are attached to contacts inside the bottom of the ignition switch and those contacts change state when the key is rotated. Sometimes thos contacts get burned and will no longer pass enough current to operate the devices on the equipment they power. Don't have a feel for how often this happens in modern cars as most of those wires are fairly low current. There is a starter relay in the box with the engine ECU, check to make sure that is working correctly, doe it click when the key is turned to the start position?. If so its contacts may be burned as this is what picks up the solenoid on the starter and it can see quite a bit of current. You can jump it out of the circuit for testing, place the key in run, unplug the starter relay harness and jump the wire from the battery to the solenoid. You need a fairly heavy gauge piece of wire and it may get hot, but the starter should crank. Obviously make sure the truck is in park and parking brake is on, or have someone in it with their foot on the brake incase it tries to move while it cranks (if it does).
 

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Fwiw one may have to replace the starter. When our P 38 starter failed and my 03 gmc van starter went (from a drive, shut off and next start an hour later-nothing) everything seemed totally dead-not sure if these models are connected the same way electrically or how many starts before the starter fails so after above tests it might be a consideration-but test on the bench first if you can-and/or the wiring to the starter.
 

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I did not do the repair when my RR went nuts.

An independent shop handled the repair, and it was in the shop (IIRC) for about two weeks, which is about 13 days longer than the shop normally takes to fix anything!

I came up with the long-shot diagnosis on your issue because of my RR experience, and a lot of experience on BMW E38s (mid 90s to early 00s 7 Series).

When an iggy switch is failing, both the BMWs and my RR have just bizarre symptoms, almost like the car's possessed.

When the RR switch was failing, the rig would drive fine, then stall, throw on every warning light it had, sit for a few seconds, then be fine again.

It finally died on the open road and had to be flat-bedded to the shop.
 

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There is a built in code reader in the car. Turn the car on, get the head unit all the way back to the home screen then press and hold your finger on the top center of the screen about 3/4" down from the top. Hold for 5 seconds then press the navigation hard button on the top right side of the head unit. If you do it right a keypad will pop up in the middle of the screen, its hard to get it to pop up unless you do it just right. Press the numbers 7, 5, and 3 in that order and then hit OK. A diagnostic screen will come up and you can display some of the codes present in the vehicle.
 

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Hey JerrytheK, what Indy shops are there in Denver and which one do you go to? I haven't owned a Range Rover in 5 years so I've lost track of them. I think I only took my P38 to one once about 10 years ago, but I forgot where they were at and the name. Sorry for hijacking the thread, but back to the issue. If the relay isn't expensive, I would just start there since changing a relay is simple and then you can eliminate that being the problem. Then go from there.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Not the relays. I swapped out with three new ones. No change.

I have disassembled most of the interior dash now, making my way to the keyswitch. I was reading a post just now on the "transponder coil" and saw something someone posted stating that if the key transponder coil doesn't get an affirmative from the ECU, then the steering column won't unlock, the gear selector won't unlock and the ACC won't turn on. In my case, all three of these willingly come on.

Also, would I really need to replace the mechanical keyswitch, or is there not a separate part, made of plastic that has a 9 pin connector that is indeed what communicates with the ECU? I would think switching out the keyswitch would mean re-keying the car and re flashing the ECU. No? Key failing to turn because lock tumblers fouling is not the issue.
 

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See the images in this thread, that is what your key switch looks like:

http://www.rangerovers.net/forum/6-range-rover-mark-iii-l322/267426-rr-will-not-start-after-attempted-repairs.html

The part identified as #1 is where all of the wires fro and to the car connect, this is the part that the contacts can get corroded, pitted, etc and cause poor connections. Replacing that part does not require rekeying the truck, or reprogramming the immobilizer system. I would pull the connector off and try to clean the connector before spending the money for a new switch piece, they are quite spendy.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I need to apologize Mark, I re read your post and understand now what you were trying to say. I saw this thread you referenced earlier this morning and read through it. Together with your post #7 I now understand what's happening here.

SO, if it were the transponder coil, the key wouldn't even turn much less unlock the steering, turn on the accessories and let me take it out of gear. Right? So, the coil is fine, the ECU/ECM is fine.
Capture.JPG
Is this the "#1" we're looking at in the blow up? (See picture I snipped off RockAuto) For $170 plus shipping, I'm happy to replace it. Dealer wants $360. Not so bueno.

Now, If I could just figure out how to remove the hood release cover on the floor that lets me remove the lower knee airbag console cover, that allows me to pull the instrument cluster, that allows me to remove the trim that exposes the keyswitch. (out of breath).

See the images in this thread, that is what your key switch looks like:

http://www.rangerovers.net/forum/6-range-rover-mark-iii-l322/267426-rr-will-not-start-after-attempted-repairs.html

The part identified as #1 is where all of the wires fro and to the car connect, this is the part that the contacts can get corroded, pitted, etc and cause poor connections. Replacing that part does not require rekeying the truck, or reprogramming the immobilizer system. I would pull the connector off and try to clean the connector before spending the money for a new switch piece, they are quite spendy.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Will I be able to test this new key switch and start the car with the dash completely pulled apart? Is there anything else I should replace/clean/lay eyes on while I'm here?

I don't want to rip this interior apart again.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
It was not the keyswitch. New one is installed and all symptoms remain. Anymore ideas?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I just noticed while scrolling through the NAV screen that the 4wd mode showed it to have it's front wheels turned hard left (they're straight) and showed it to be in Neutral 4Lo. It isn't. In fact all the terrain selector lights are lit up on the console. Is this just a test before the engine is started? When I clicked on the selector feature it said "Terraine something Unavailable". I went back out to take a picture of that message and now, that screen is just blank. It just has an image of the knob and nothing selected. Is this an anomaly or does it mean something? Would this show up on a $500 Land Rover approved scan tool?
 

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Well, I'm stumped. It definitely sounds like an electrical problem of some sort though. Have you looked in the back panels where there is a fusebox and also the other side where the DVD Nav is, and see if there has been corrosion and/or any water ingress of any type back there? Also in the spare wheel well? I would just investigate all the electrical boxes/fuses/relays. Sorry you're having to deal with this after just buying it! Let us know what you eventually find so it might help someone else in the same boat someday.
 

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Discussion Starter #19

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Before you take things apart, you can easily check to see if it's working by testing voltages at your fuses. There may also still be a small rocker switch above the pedals that will bypass the ignition switch for position 2.

Do all of your dash lights look normal, or anything missing or extra(overheat light)? Exactly what happens when you try to crank? Have you checked your fuses?

The ignition switch in your 08 is different than most of the information on here for 03 to mid-07, you don't have a locking solenoid(or steering column)

Symptoms sound like a power loss, and with a good battery, may want to start looking at main grounds.
 
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