Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC - Page 3
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Thread: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

  1. #31
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Quote Originally Posted by avos
    @Ukraine Range

    The Eaton is about 1.87 Ltr, and is running about 11/11.5 psi. You can get more power by spinning it faster (which I said), but the question is how much(or how little). The higher the pressure the less efficient this eaton type becomes which is common knowledge.

    Everyone how they like it, being it 200 or 500 hp
    So we have an Eaton on the 4.2? Someone told me it was a Lysholm? I guess either way they are both positive displacement (roots) type blowers. If it is a Heaton, and it's 1.87L, then its a variation of the M112, which is what Ford used in their Terminator (just sold mine ). This would make sense since Ford owned Jag at the time. That being said, the M112 can take upwards of 16-17 lbs of boost before it starts to get maxed out and it becomes law of diminishing returns. At that point, most people who want more power go to a bigger displacement blower (Whipple, for example). This is why I say there is power left on the table running 10-11 psi stock. Even more if you want to port the blower and get bigger injectors, a bigger heat exchanger, yada, yada, yada...remember, LR has to protect their engines so they go way, way conservative. I bet the stock a/f curve goes pig rich over 4k to keep everything cool when in fact 11.5 start to finish is perfectly fine and actually maximizes efficiency.

    And I understand about blower efficiency and overspinning it...I'm saying for THIS specific application there there is more power to be had in the blown 4.2 because its making 400 hp which is NOT a lot for that displacement with a 1.87L roots blower on it @ 10-11 lbs. My 4.6 DOHC with the Eaton M112 (1.8L) blower, a 2.95" pulley and tune was upwards of 520 crank hp, and there was another 20 or so HP but I didn't want to bump the timing any more. That stock Eaton spins at ~12k in stock form, but with my setup it was close to 17k with no drop or diminished performance.

    I do agree that a smaller pulley won't ALWAYS result in increased power, BUT...that is only if you're maxed out on the stock setup, which these RRS S/C's are nowhere near.

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  3. #32
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    The old Supercharged engine in my 09 is pretty fast and I'm pretty happy with it. I drive mine pretty hard in the Rockies and my only compliant that it runs out of steam passing over 80 mph. Mine gets only 8 mpg in town and I dread to think that isn't going to get any better with all that horsepower. I am waiting for the diesel. These Turbo Diesels that Mercedes builds are excellent engines with tons of power and hopefully as the price of gas goes up Land Rover will introduce their diesel engines to the US.

    Last time I was in England I only saw Range Rovers in London. The biggest SUVs in the country where Jeep Cherokees.

  4. #33
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Quote Originally Posted by ChipN
    The old Supercharged engine in my 09 is pretty fast and I'm pretty happy with it. I drive mine pretty hard in the Rockies and my only compliant that it runs out of steam passing over 80 mph. Mine gets only 8 mpg in town and I dread to think that isn't going to get any better with all that horsepower. I am waiting for the diesel. These Turbo Diesels that Mercedes builds are excellent engines with tons of power and hopefully as the price of gas goes up Land Rover will introduce their diesel engines to the US.

    Last time I was in England I only saw Range Rovers in London. The biggest SUVs in the country where Jeep Cherokees.
    Um, ok.

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  6. #34
    Premium Member TripleE's Avatar
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Quote Originally Posted by Ukraine Range
    I do agree that a smaller pulley won't ALWAYS result in increased power, BUT...that is only if you're maxed out on the stock setup, which these RRS S/C's are nowhere near.
    Therein lies what we're also saying about the Sport - no one has shown where we're at concerning the stock setup; so making absolute statements such as "smaller pulley = more power" (yes, very likely) and "nowhere near" (maxing out the stock setup) seems counter productive to the purpose of online forums; we just don't want to spread misinformation, especially if it hasn't been shown.

    '07 RRS
    '03 325i
    '94 GSX

  7. #35
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Quote Originally Posted by TripleE
    Quote Originally Posted by Ukraine Range
    I do agree that a smaller pulley won't ALWAYS result in increased power, BUT...that is only if you're maxed out on the stock setup, which these RRS S/C's are nowhere near.
    Therein lies what we're also saying about the Sport - no one has shown where we're at concerning the stock setup; so making absolute statements such as "smaller pulley = more power" (yes, very likely) and "nowhere near" (maxing out the stock setup) seems counter productive to the purpose of online forums; we just don't want to spread misinformation, especially if it hasn't been shown.
    Right but a 1.87L roots blower at 11 psi is NOT maxed out, doesn't matter which application.

  8. #36
    Premium Member TripleE's Avatar
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    I didn't say the blower was maxed out; the blower itself it just one variable. The intercoolers are the other major factor. I myself find it very strange that the Sport has been out 4+ years but we haven't seen the dyno graphs.

    '07 RRS
    '03 325i
    '94 GSX

  9. #37
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Quote Originally Posted by TripleE
    I didn't say the blower was maxed out; the blower itself it just one variable. The intercoolers are the other major factor. I myself find it very strange that the Sport has been out 4+ years but we haven't seen the dyno graphs.
    I honestly don't think that Intercoolers are a 'major' factor. I would say air, fuel, timing and engine makeup (does it have forged rods, crank, pistons, etc) are your big parts which deserve first priority if increasing boost. Stock intercooler(s) are fine for moderate increases in power. They'll only serve to move a little more fluid around keeping the engine cooler for longer hence delaying heatsoak which is inevitable no matter what. With a bigger intercooler, you may heat soak after 45 mins to an hour, vs 20-30 minutes with the stock piece and some hard driving - but it'll eventually happen to every s/c engine. Could you benefit from bigger intercoolers? Yes. Is it necessary? Not at all.

    The engine's forged, the compression ratio is low - the 4.2 is a prime candidate for more power.

    As far as dyno graphs, the demographic of a typical buyer doesn't really lend itself much to performance, or at least to the point of changing pulleys and tuning it. I'm sure they're out there, just not that many hence the reason you can't find any info on them. Plus the fact that if anything breaks its 4x as much to fix, so nobody wants to fool around. But I am certain that 450+ hp is safely and rather easily attainable judging by the engine makeup, blower size and stock specs...its just that that person has to have the dough and desire to grab those extra ponies... and that's not me!!

  10. #38
    Premium Member TripleE's Avatar
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Quote Originally Posted by Ukraine Range
    But I am certain that 450+ hp is safely and rather easily attainable
    I would like to think so also, but I'm still waiting to see it.

    The demographic for customers? Heck I'm not concerned with customer graphs, I want to see one from a vendor who's selling the product...

    '07 RRS
    '03 325i
    '94 GSX

  11. #39
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Quote Originally Posted by TripleE
    Quote Originally Posted by Ukraine Range
    But I am certain that 450+ hp is safely and rather easily attainable
    I would like to think so also, but I'm still waiting to see it.

    The demographic for customers? Heck I'm not concerned with customer graphs, I want to see one from a vendor who's selling the product...
    I'd be interested in seeing a package too, from a qualified and knowledgable tuner, but I'd have to guess that there's just no demand for it.

    Semi-related question...anyone know what the redline is in this thing? There's no indication on the tach.

  12. #40
    LIFETIME CONTRIBUTOR umbertob's Avatar
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Well, Overfinch does offer one such package, called Supercharged Sports Pack. Knowing the company, I am sure the numbers they advertise are not made up (meaning they dynoed the engine), they claim +50bhp and + 70lbft on the 4.2 liter S/C engine, obtained through a combination of "uprated" supercharger, reprogrammed ECU, freer flow cat-back exhaust system and air intake, and speed limiter removal. Also knowing the company, I imagine it costs mega-bucks. http://www.overfinch.com

  13. #41
    Premium Member TripleE's Avatar
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    I'd have to agree that I don't think Overfinch wouldn't falsify a product, but it'd be nice to see where the power is coming from. Looks like it may be at the rev limit as they raised it? I'm sure the exhaust and intake is "mega-bucks" alone on that one...

    EDIT: What is the cost?

    '07 RRS
    '03 325i
    '94 GSX

  14. #42
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Quote Originally Posted by umbertob
    Well, Overfinch does offer one such package, called Supercharged Sports Pack. Knowing the company, I am sure the numbers they advertise are not made up (meaning they dynoed the engine), they claim +50bhp and + 70lbft on the 4.2 liter S/C engine, obtained through a combination of "uprated" supercharger, reprogrammed ECU, freer flow cat-back exhaust system and air intake, and speed limiter removal. Also knowing the company, I imagine it costs mega-bucks. http://www.overfinch.com
    Because its Overfinch and LR, yes this package would probably be a ton of money relative to other vehicles, even though it looks to be a very typical s/c'd engine upgrade (pulley, intake, exhaust, tune). This is assuming that by 'uprated supercharger' they mean putting out more boost via a smaller pulley with the same blower. If they mean an actual bigger displacement blower, then the cost of the upgrade would be astronomical and quite frankly anyone paying that much money for 50 hp needs a visit to psych ward. The apparent omission of injectors as part of this kit makes me think its just a smaller pulley, not a bigger blower...the last thing you want to do is starve a blown car of fuel.

    Now that I think about it, I cannot imagine for the life of me that they would do an actual blower swap...and I am also interested to see what the price is.

  15. #43
    LIFETIME CONTRIBUTOR umbertob's Avatar
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Back in 2006 (when the performance upgrade first came out) Overfinch wanted something like 5 grands. That's British Pounds. Anyone willing to guess how much the conversion would cost in US$ from Overfinch USA, in 2009 and with today's exchange rates? I'm going with 10 K's, including 2 free Overfinch stickers.

  16. #44
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Quote Originally Posted by umbertob
    Back in 2006 (when the performance upgrade first came out) Overfinch wanted something like 5 grands. That's British Pounds. Anyone willing to guess how much the conversion would cost in US$ from Overfinch USA, in 2009 and with today's exchange rates? I'm going with 10 K's, including 2 free Overfinch stickers.
    Actually it'd be about $7500 which is still ri-f'n-diculous. I understand its Land Rover, but come on...intake, exhaust, pulley and tune should cost roughly $1500-2000 US and that's WITH labor!

  17. #45
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    Re: Shocking Video of 2010 RRS SC vs 2009 RRS SC

    Our New Upper pulley provides 2.5-3 lbs of boost and should add a minimum of 55+ hp when coupled with PSE's High Performance S-Porting. The nose drive will be carefully machined down to allow clearance for the new pulley.

    Range Rover porting through PSE Superchargers is exclusive to Eurotoys Ltd. and we are the first to provide this for your Range Rover. You can visit PSE Superchargers at: www.pse.us/index.htm

    This procedure increases Eaton M112 supercharger efficiency, while decreasing blower discharge temperatures to give you more available power. This is for all Range Rover Models: Full-size Range Rover & Range Rover Sport S/C 4.2L.


    Our supercharger is an Eaton M112, the exact one on my Cobra so I know its limits and capabilities.

    http://eurotoysltd.com/catalog/product_ ... ts_id=1182

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