Anyone else seeing these conversions not holding up very well? I've had my 01 HSE for 8 yrs now, so coils could have 50k plus on them and time.
Should rust be common and hard to avoid in the Northeast? Would Air struts fare better, if I got a revised set? Pros and cons from a cost standpoint? Opinions please and ideas too
Post up how long yours lasted, I would do a poll here but I don't see the option on my cell
I'm on air but in cars I have seen aftermarket springs sag over time. Not sure why as OEM seem to last the life of a car. Are you sure that your struts aren't dead giving you more bounce?
My one is on coils, found a broken rear one not long after I got her about six months ago. Replaced the two reads with heavy duty ones because I carry slot of wait. I intended to put her back on air but looking at her history which I have. I am not going to bother, will be changing them all next year for arnott springs. Expensive but much better quality. Hope that helps.
Maybe it's the struts, but springs aren't looking good... might as well do both once you rip her open.
You guys mention Dunlop and Arnott, are those solely air based like OEM or an improved design? I do not know what brands of coil conversions we are all using on our P38s
so you want to go back to air bags 8 years later . how's the compressor , valve block , air lines etc first question is, is it all there as it will require rebuilding or replacing . make shore its going to work or you could be opening a can of worms , there's a reason its on coils???
as for the preference. its more of a personal preference .
as for the life of airbags and components its hit and miss some last years and some don't, hence the coil conversion.
there is only 2 parts to a coil conversion a spring and a shocks , springs sag shocks go soft
there's many part to air bags and they all cause problems of there own.
Agreed, I bought it as a coil convert, so going back to air would be a marathon vs just new springs and shocks. Just hope I find a brand that will last longer as I love my 30th and want to keep it a long time.
Not sure how much coils cost in the US but with Dunlop OEM air springs at £50 a corner from Island 4x4 and another £30 for a valve block and compressor rebuild kit, it's probably cheaper than coils. It isn't difficult either.
Do you actually have a coilover conversion? A "coilover" is a coil spring with a strut in the middle.
Most folks just have a coil conversion done... so instead of an air bag holding the rig up , you have coil spring holding the rigup with separate dampers/ shocks .
edit: odd I wrote this last night and forgot to hit post... question still applies though
Yes, prior owner ditched the OEM air for the coil springs and strut setup. I don't know the condition of the remaining air parts, thus I will not rush on a plan just yet. Not too worried about the rust, or the feel of the suspension in its current state.
So, as you did not actually answer Toadie's question about "Coil Over and Strut" and you mention this set up yet again,
Do you have "Coils" and "Shocks" in the normal separate places. or are there "Struts" inside the coils? (Coil over strut setup)
If so, post a couple of pictures, as it would be an unusual setup.
As for ride differences? I have 2 2002s here side by side being driven daily.
White one is EAS with Arnott Gen II bags (Wish I had Dunlops) and Borrego is coils. We have some lumpy and potholed roads around here and the EAS is FAR superior ride for that kind of 35mph driving.
On high speed runs down to LA I found the coils were terrible for handling on the LA freeways at normal (90+) mph left lane speeds and that it required full concentration when hitting even small surface irregularities. Same run a week later with white one, EAS handled smoothly and had absolutely none of the skittering around. Practically a relaxing experience:thumb:
Both are running the same Cooper tyres.
Aftermarket springs seem generally not as well made as factory in my experience, not sure why. Maybe find the OEM maker and get the size/rate you want from them? Old porsches, my old D90, went back to original on everything. Isolators in the D90 and Gwagon are nice for a bit of lift/cushion while keeping stock springs.
My P38 rides on factory air - everything can be kept working right pretty easily and just check the system regularly with a soapy spray bottle. Just o-rings and plastic tubes, all pretty basic stuff that's fun to fix. Haha. Can't beat the ride and the ride height variation capability define these cars. Would never go to coils.
If I were to consider a mod it would be to Arnott Gen 3 - which are progressive in the opposite way of original air. They are a bit tighter at cruise height and are softer when raised - this was a design flaw of the originals in my view, but I don't really want a harder ride at cruising height. But I might try it if/when the second set of factory bags on her break (they've been replaced once).
Errrrrrr........................
Tough to find a spec for factory springs as, in the case of the P-38, there never were any Thus no OEM maker.............
Ummm.. UK police vehicles were spec-ed with coils. The BECM has a switch for Normal/UK Police. Switching this automatically switches to "EAS Manual" or coils. without having to resort to the normal external jumper leads.
As for a spec, front is normally 133 lb/in and rear 150 lb/in. With the P38 greater overhang and rear weight, 180 lb/in might be better with 220 lb/in if you carry a load all the time.
Well, Hush Mah Puppies!
You just Leann something new here every dang day!8-0=
So, that kinda makes sense as the plod would be quite embarrassed if the squaddie went to bump stops right in the middle of a high speed chase!
So, is the EAS the only thing this setting changes? (Often wondered)
Thanks for the info!:thumb:
A bit more info but I can't edit my previous. Police spec cars were built by Land Rover Special Vehicles to a spec that each police force ordered, hence mine has things like front fogs and headlamp wash/wipe that would normally only have been fitted to higher spec cars but manual cloth seats so the interior is more hardwearing than the leather, no trip computer, no stereo and no cruise control. Fitting coil springs to a P38 would invalidate the type approval making it impossible to register them for the road. Not only that, with a lot of weight in and raising the centre of gravity (I removed over 5 kg of wiring loom from above the headlining on mine without taking into account the lights on the roof), driving at high speed without the suspension lowered would make them downright dangerous.
Indeed I have coils not coilover haha... oops... do my coils pop out on a lift or do they have bolted on mounts? I only know standard quick struts, aka McPherson, KYB,Bilsteins I run on Audi and Jap cars etc
So EAS uses rubber Dildo shaped airbags, and no springs or struts secondary? I am in the dark as I see my P38 has space for coils and I guess some struts are hidden nearby out of view hehe
Originally it would have had the air springs where the coils have been fitted and the shock absorbers mounted next to them. The air springs were held in place with clips so they couldn't come out, a coil spring conversion adds bolts and clamps to stop them coming out.
To answer the original question . . . "Coilover Conversion Longevity" . . . . I suspect it depends on how long the owner wants a crappy ride, and lack of height adjustment.
Most 2nd owners buy these converted. If I can get air parts, i would go back if it's price competitive to new coils and likely to last a while without failing.
Mine is on coils and has been for many years..By looking at the paint cracking on them and the rust that has developed, I would say they’ve been on there for 10years at the least.. All the rubber components on the mounts have mostly degraded as well...
So far they’ve been working great..I wheel the crap out of mine too..Still works great and still going strong!
The classics seemed to manage pretty well for over 20 years of production run.
Re-converting to air may require a lot more than new springs of course, depending on the depth of the conversion. Compressor, lines, valves etc. come to mind.
But the Classic was designed to be on coils and also had the Boge self levelling strut on the rear as well as the coil springs. A P38 that has simply had the air springs replaced with coils doesn't have that so is much worse. Virtually all conversions people do just leave everything else in place so with a rebuild kit for the compressor and a set of O rings in teh valve block, you're back up and running.
I know, I had a '93 long wheelbase Classic that had originally been on air, so didn't have the Boge unit, but had been converted to coils. Worst of all worlds, inferior to both the air suspension and an original car on coil springs. Put any weight in the back or hitch up a trailer and it sat so low at the back you could barely see over the bonnet, fit stiffer springs and the fillings fell out of your teeth on anything other than billiard table smooth roads. So I bought a P38 purely for the air suspension and realised it is so superior I can't see why anyone would want to ruin a P38 by fitting coil springs, particularly when the EAS system is so cheap and simple to maintain once you understand it.
I'm in the minority on this forum, but coils are simply much, much, much easier to live with for those of us who live in climates where EAS fails A. LOT. Or who aren't purists and have aftermarket racks, bumpers (including swing-outs for spares), tow......and having/do own multiple P38s, the air ride is better. But not at the expense (IMHO) of having constant EAS issues. I own 5 EAS blocks & rebuilding them (after the first one) isn't hard. But takes time. Ditto the pump. Ditto the dessicant. Ditto checking the lines. Ditto the sensors. Ditto the lines.......and when taken into consideration that literally 50% of forum ??? posts are about EAS issues. Yeah enough else goes wrong with these.
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