1997 P38 Crank no start.
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Thread: 1997 P38 Crank no start.

  1. #1
    FRESHMAN ROVER
    Join Date
    January 7th, 2019
    Location
    USA - Nassau County, NY
    Posts
    8

    1997 P38 Crank no start.

    Looking for help.

    I have been dealing with a no crank no CEL issue, as asked in my other posts.

    This weekend i decided to investigate further and removed the signal wire (Brown Red - RN) off the starter in order to check if i had 12 volts at key position II.
    With a helper at the wheel in order to turn the ignition key on, he then stated that i had a CEL.

    It now seems that there is continuous 12v to signal wire regardless of key position, in fact with no key in it is registering 12v.

    the other thing i noticed when testing for the 12v was that with the signal wire off and the key on, i could hear the fuel pump excite.

    SO it dawned on me to remove relay 19 out of the fuse box to check if it interrupted power which it did, when i put the relay back in and turned the key, i could hear the fuel pump again so tried to start. at this point i have crank no start.


    to summarize, i can repeat this cycle of crank no start and have the fuel pump excite. i checked for spark and fuel.

    fuel i have but there is no spark.

    In short it appears that something is interrupting the start cycle.

    I now throw it you guys for the answer.

    IS it the ignition switch?
    IS it the Immobilizer on the Ig Switch?
    IS it the BECM and ECM coding issue?

    What would keep 12v at the signal wire?
    HELP????

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  3. #2
    JUNIOR ROVER
    Join Date
    October 17th, 2017
    Location
    East England
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    808

    Re: 1997 P38 Crank no start.

    No CEL on a GEMS, which a 97 is, means the engine ECU has not been powered up by the BeCM as they have lost sync.
    96 4.6HSE
    98 4.0 Police spec
    and a number of others I maintain for the owners.

  4. #3
    FRESHMAN ROVER
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    January 7th, 2019
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    USA - Nassau County, NY
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    Re: 1997 P38 Crank no start.

    NO I have CEL. please reread my post.

    I have constant 12 volt at signal wire, this is stopping the cycle upon key turn. if i pullthe wire off the check engine light goes on.

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  6. #4
    SENIOR ROVER
    Join Date
    June 11th, 2016
    Location
    northern va 22003
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    1,375

    Re: 1997 P38 Crank no start.

    possible failed crank sensor.
    2k p38 4.6
    95 lwb 4.6
    01 d2 4.0

  7. #5
    FRESHMAN ROVER
    Join Date
    January 7th, 2019
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    USA - Nassau County, NY
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    Re: 1997 P38 Crank no start.

    the main problem seems to be that i have to pull relay 19 to get engine to crank over at which point it has no spark.

  8. #6
    JUNIOR ROVER
    Join Date
    October 17th, 2017
    Location
    East England
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    808

    Re: 1997 P38 Crank no start.

    With relay 19 removed you've got no power to the engine ECU or fuel injectors so you won't have a spark (or fuel). Relay 16 is the starter relay, if you pull that do you still have 12V on the Red/Brown wire? However, I think you are doing something wrong as with a permanent 12V on the starter signal wire, you would have a permanently running starter. Has it ever worked properly or is this something that has always been like this since you have owned it? Have you, or anyone else replaced the underbonnet fusebox with one for a different year? There are 3 different ones, up to 97, 97-98 and 99 onwards and they are not interchangeable, you need the correct one for your VIN.
    96 4.6HSE
    98 4.0 Police spec
    and a number of others I maintain for the owners.

  9. #7
    SENIOR ROVER
    Join Date
    June 11th, 2016
    Location
    northern va 22003
    Posts
    1,375

    Re: 1997 P38 Crank no start.

    with key off you will have 12 volts at the ignition switch because p38 is reverse polarity ignition, as you energize each circuit (key turned position 1, 2) each circuit becomes grounded, starter circuit becomes grounded for start energize time and then upon release of key it goes to power stand by.
    2k p38 4.6
    95 lwb 4.6
    01 d2 4.0

  10. #8
    JUNIOR ROVER
    Join Date
    October 17th, 2017
    Location
    East England
    Posts
    808

    Re: 1997 P38 Crank no start.

    But he isn't talking about at the ignition switch, he reckons he's got 12V on the Brown/Red wire to the starter solenoid. I agree, he will have 12V at the ignition switch as it grounds the BeCM which in turn applies ground to the coil of the starter relay causing it to operate and switch 12V to the Brown/Red wire to the starter solenoid to energise the starter. So with 12V on this wire all the time, the starter will turn all the time.
    96 4.6HSE
    98 4.0 Police spec
    and a number of others I maintain for the owners.

  11. #9
    FRESHMAN ROVER
    Join Date
    January 7th, 2019
    Location
    USA - Nassau County, NY
    Posts
    8
    Worked it all out. It seems the fusebox repair failed. I replaced the under bonnet fusebox and all works well. Thank you

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