Timing chains etc...
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Thread: Timing chains etc...

  1. #1
    JACK'S GRANDAD leftlanetruckin's Avatar
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    Timing chains etc...

    Not a MkIII, but the same Jag 5.0. 2010 LR4 I picked up for a buddy of mine, $4500!
    It's "noisy" up front, so will just go ahead and do the full set. It had supposedly had them all done in '15 (same owners since '11), but I'm guessing they used the plastic pins still, instead of aluminum. Cost them $5500.....ouch, lot of coin for it to sound like a diesel....
    I was going to check the chain, then maybe just do the guides etc, but can't find an accurate way to check it!
    Would save a load of time, plus all the specialist tools.
    No CEL on, runs great, just noisy. Hooked up the GAP tool from the wife's '11SC, and no untoward readings.

    Thoughts on the guides? Any way to tell you're getting the new style guides etc?
    Will try to take pics and give any hints. Lots of threads, but few "complete" ones.

    Cheers
    '98 P38 HSE, with 385hp/385ft lbs of LSx under the hood. Fully functional HVAC, EAS, etc.
    '11 L322 SC
    '04 DiscoII - wheeling rig
    '02 P38, '79 924 for the kids.
    Custom fabrication, engine rebuilds and knowledge that comes from experience and not Google, always available for a reasonable cost.

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  3. #2
    Premium Member Keralis's Avatar
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    Just speculation here, but could it be the cam phaser sound?

    My guess is they did not do it for $5500, my Sport back in maybe 2014 had guides, tensioners, chain, and four cam phasers done for ~$8,000. I ended up selling it to my good friend and I still see it every so often, and it sounds like it should. It must have over 160k miles on it, I sold it at around 130k



    Main issue are not the guides anymore, it is the tensioners. Big issue is no one does short oil intervals, which these oil pressure dependent (cam phasers, hydaulic tensioners, etc..) must have.
    I'm the guy that buys a chicken salad to only eat the chicken
    2017 Range Rover HSE
    2014 Range Rover Sport Dynamic

  4. #3
    JACK'S GRANDAD leftlanetruckin's Avatar
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    Not sure what bad cam phasers would sound like, so ........
    Could well have been the case though. And at @$1300 for the 4, it would make sense
    '98 P38 HSE, with 385hp/385ft lbs of LSx under the hood. Fully functional HVAC, EAS, etc.
    '11 L322 SC
    '04 DiscoII - wheeling rig
    '02 P38, '79 924 for the kids.
    Custom fabrication, engine rebuilds and knowledge that comes from experience and not Google, always available for a reasonable cost.

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  6. #4
    JUNIOR ROVER
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    Have you seen this video? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1E4ahs-SHI
    It show the change in design and a nice short cut of leaving the chain and just replacing guides and tensioners.
    '99 Range Rover HSE
    '02 Audi S6

  7. #5
    SOLIHULL ROVER Mrmerlin's Avatar
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    Make sure to do the cam phasers as suggested,
    my dealer told me they have done a few without them , after the job they sounded as noisy as when they came in,
    and had to take the whole thing apart again.

    I have seen a few Videos pointing out the same thing where someone took it in to have the guides, chains, and tensioners done and it still sounded like a diesel, since they didnt do the phasers.


    NOTE I have had them do the chains the guides the tensioners and the phasers, at 105K,
    when I got it back it was like a new truck, the only problems after this was a having to add a set of injectors to my 2468 bank.
    This was making the engine run rough now its pretty smooth.

    Long oil change intervals kill these parts
    I suggest every 5 k or less oil and filter changes
    Stan

    2010 Supercharged, Santorini Black/ BlackLeather/Piano Black wood

  8. #6
    JACK'S GRANDAD leftlanetruckin's Avatar
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    There is a slight metallic knocking noise, which I first thought was a bad pulley bearing. Removed the belt, still the same. Thinking maybe a stretched chain? I wont get parts until I get home next time, but could pull the front cover to check it all out I guess? Any hardship in doing that, then removing the stuff to do the whole chain job if need be?
    '98 P38 HSE, with 385hp/385ft lbs of LSx under the hood. Fully functional HVAC, EAS, etc.
    '11 L322 SC
    '04 DiscoII - wheeling rig
    '02 P38, '79 924 for the kids.
    Custom fabrication, engine rebuilds and knowledge that comes from experience and not Google, always available for a reasonable cost.

  9. #7
    SOLIHULL ROVER Mrmerlin's Avatar
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    with the phasers you cant see anything wrong since the wear occurs inside the units and they wont hold oil pressure so they rattle
    2 intake 2 exhaust
    Stan

    2010 Supercharged, Santorini Black/ BlackLeather/Piano Black wood

  10. #8
    JACK'S GRANDAD leftlanetruckin's Avatar
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    Thanks Stan
    I'm starting to think the rattle/diesel noise may well be them then.
    If I just do the guides and tensioners, then the phasers, it would save him some coin by not having to do the whole shebang? Or is doing those as involved as the whole timing deal?
    Maybe worth pulling the front off to investigate before spending any money
    '98 P38 HSE, with 385hp/385ft lbs of LSx under the hood. Fully functional HVAC, EAS, etc.
    '11 L322 SC
    '04 DiscoII - wheeling rig
    '02 P38, '79 924 for the kids.
    Custom fabrication, engine rebuilds and knowledge that comes from experience and not Google, always available for a reasonable cost.

  11. #9
    JACK'S GRANDAD leftlanetruckin's Avatar
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    The plastic guides are just sliding in the aluminum. I got a video but it won't post from my fone.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Timing chains etc...-b17e7735-9926-47b6-9b33-05d46cdfc777_1557371251241.jpg  
    '98 P38 HSE, with 385hp/385ft lbs of LSx under the hood. Fully functional HVAC, EAS, etc.
    '11 L322 SC
    '04 DiscoII - wheeling rig
    '02 P38, '79 924 for the kids.
    Custom fabrication, engine rebuilds and knowledge that comes from experience and not Google, always available for a reasonable cost.

  12. #10
    LEGACY VENDOR
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    Thats interesting. The plastic part of the guide does come off very easily but it should be kept in place by the direction of rotation of the motor. I wonder if those guides have been changed? If you dont take care when inserting the guide on the right of the photo (left hand guide) the plastic may have been dislodged.

    The 2 photos show the different guides and tensioners. Apart from the steel insert on the new guide, the plunger on the tensioner is wider.

    Timing chains etc...-20190509_110530-medium-.jpg

    Timing chains etc...-20190509_110600-medium-.jpg
    P38 2002 4.6 Vogue
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  13. #11
    JACK'S GRANDAD leftlanetruckin's Avatar
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    I saw pictures of the new ones, which looked like the ones you posted. I'm guessing the clips get removed at installation? There are no "side pieces" on the plastic guides in this thing.
    As a side note, anyone know the best place to get the whole shebang? Seen the tools for sale on Amazon etc, but there seems to be a LOT of choices for the timing set.
    I tried getting with an AB vendor, twice by email and a fone call yesterday, but still no prices back from them.
    '98 P38 HSE, with 385hp/385ft lbs of LSx under the hood. Fully functional HVAC, EAS, etc.
    '11 L322 SC
    '04 DiscoII - wheeling rig
    '02 P38, '79 924 for the kids.
    Custom fabrication, engine rebuilds and knowledge that comes from experience and not Google, always available for a reasonable cost.

  14. #12
    FRESHMAN ROVER
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    The circular detent on the rear of the guide indicates that it is the later type of guide.

    The chain tensioner clips don't get pulled until everything is back in place and the timing marks on the chain and the guides are aligned.

    As someone noted, extended oil changes are mostly responsible for VVT noise.

    It's not unusual for the oil ways to gum up after several years' use with extended oil changes.

    If you want to try and save a few bucks you could put it all back together and use a flushing agent (or a substituted quart of ATF and seven quarts of 5-20 engine oil) for 500 miles or so then do another oil and filter change.

    Alternatively, replace the VVT's now while it's apart.

    I believe Atlantic British just announced a timing set for the 5.0

    https://www.roverparts.com/Parts/TCK5030

    Your budget, your choice.

    Rob

  15. #13
    JACK'S GRANDAD leftlanetruckin's Avatar
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    While removing stuff yesterday, noticed some zip ties holding a coolant fitting together!
    It's the Y piece that connects to the throttle body heater and the push fitting to the water pump.
    It connects to LR013687 hose.
    I cant find the hose, but found it on a Jag forum, AJ812141 is an old part number.
    LR part number anyone?
    Also having a hard time finding the part number for the front pulley bolt. Mine is grade 12.9 right hand thread.

    Thing isnt that old ffs! I have easier times finding parts for my Lsx powered P38 rofl
    '98 P38 HSE, with 385hp/385ft lbs of LSx under the hood. Fully functional HVAC, EAS, etc.
    '11 L322 SC
    '04 DiscoII - wheeling rig
    '02 P38, '79 924 for the kids.
    Custom fabrication, engine rebuilds and knowledge that comes from experience and not Google, always available for a reasonable cost.

  16. #14
    JUNIOR ROVER MARK_C's Avatar
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    The black plastic clips on the side of plastic slide never get removed, those provide tension to hold the plastic part to the metal tensioner arm so the slide doesn't move around on the arm. If someone snapped those clips off, then you need new ones.
    M Canning
    Massachusetts, USA
    2006 HSE Bonnati Grey/Charcoal Interior

  17. #15
    JACK'S GRANDAD leftlanetruckin's Avatar
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    Re: Timing chains etc...

    Cheers Mark.
    I'm ripping it apart as we speak. Found an ignition coil that was held together with insulation tape after the idiots lost the hold down bolt..... Love getting into something where a supposed great mechanic has been before. Idiots
    '98 P38 HSE, with 385hp/385ft lbs of LSx under the hood. Fully functional HVAC, EAS, etc.
    '11 L322 SC
    '04 DiscoII - wheeling rig
    '02 P38, '79 924 for the kids.
    Custom fabrication, engine rebuilds and knowledge that comes from experience and not Google, always available for a reasonable cost.

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