LPG conversion
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Thread: LPG conversion

  1. #1
    JUNIOR ROVER
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    April 30th, 2005
    Location
    Alton Hampshire UK/Cape Town SA
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    931

    LPG conversion

    The time has come when I am considering converting to LPG.I have done online searching for companies to do this and read many posts here as well.
    I would like to hear updated info from owners with LPG experience and especially form UK based ones as to the most recommended installer.I am in Hampshire so Installers in the the South are preferable.Interesting to note prices vary from £1300 to £2700.(multipoint sequential and installation can take from 1 to 5 days depending on installer)
    My MOT is due in FEB and once that is negotiated without too much expense,I will be ready to proceed,I hope.
    John W
    1995 4.6hse
    Enjoy it!!

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  3. #2
    SENIOR ROVER q-rover's Avatar
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    August 14th, 2007
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    Norway
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    Re: LPG conversion

    Is it worth it?
    The value of the vehicle can't be that much now, and it will take quite a few miles
    to be able to recoup the cost of the installation. If selling the car, you'll never get
    the 'investment' back.
    1998 Autobiography 4.6 V8 of course

  4. #3
    JUNIOR ROVER
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    Alton Hampshire UK/Cape Town SA
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    Re: LPG conversion

    Quote Originally Posted by q-rover
    Is it worth it?
    The value of the vehicle can't be that much now, and it will take quite a few miles
    to be able to recoup the cost of the installation. If selling the car, you'll never get
    the 'investment' back.
    I doubt very much that is worth from a commercial point of view and I dont consider anything to do with the RR as an investment.I dont intend to sell at so it becomes a personal choice with prehaps some long term financial benefit.
    John W
    1995 4.6hse
    Enjoy it!!

  5. #4
    FRESHMAN ROVER
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    September 12th, 2006
    Location
    Manchester, UK
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    107

    Re: LPG conversion

    John,

    I looked into this for a long time before I did it myself. The views I have are:

    Only fit a multi-point sequential system to the 1999- Thor engined cars - which will be upwards of £2200 for someone to do it properly. Prinz systems seems to be the best quality, but there are other systems that are almost as good including BRC and others. Installation is key as this can affect all sorts of things including mpg. For example, some installers say a key issue is how close the injectors are to the head will affect performance.

    You can fit a non-multi-point system to the 1995-1999 Gems engined cars, but beware of backfire problems from poor installations. RPi say only fit the older non-multi-point systems if you re-chip the engine management system (for about £800) to avoid the backfiring, but these systems are about £800 cheaper than the multi-point ones. Don't expect quite as good mpg from these types of system.

    Expect anything from a 10% to 20% reduction in mpg on LPG. Always fit good quality plug leads (some people swear by Magnecore).

    LPG prices can vary hugely - presumably due to some people trying to recoup the installation costs. Expect to pay from 50p/litre at specialists to 68p/litre at some motorway sites (therefore shop around more than for petrol) - you can get a great little road atlas showing where all the LPG sites are and then use petrolprices.com to work out which ones are the cheapest. LPG prices also seem to go up in winter and down again in the spring/summer. Beware of any changes to the government policy on duty, as a 2ppl rise on duty also applies to LPG as Unleaded etc. This can put the LPG up by a greater percentage than petrol/diesel.

    A 90l donut tank will only fill up to about 78l, so doing roughly 14.5mpg the range is only about 240 miles. Some reckon you can adjust the tank valve slightly to get a bit more in, but I wouldn't recommend it. Just accept that you're limited to 78l. The tank takes up the spare wheel well, so get a good can of the tyre weld puncture repair, and hope you don't get a puncture!

    Factor into the cost that you still need some petrol to start in the morning - I use about £1 every 100 miles. Also factor in the servicing costs (£45/year), which usually is a check of the programme and a filter change (filters would last 30k so are not needed annually). Some people change their plug change routine, but I've stuck to the Platinum plugs and changed them every 36k without problem.

    Pay-pack for mine was 16,500 miles based on current unleaded vs. LPG costs. I've done 70k mostly motorway miles on LPG with no LPG related problems and reckoned to have saved £6,400 on top of the cost of conversion.

    I'd definately do it again!!! But do the conversion right - don't try to get it on the cheap as it will cause more problems in the long run. Get recommendations for installers that have experience on installations for your Gems engine, talk to several of them and only work with the ones who are open about the problems and who you feel comfortable with.
    current: 2004 4.4 Vogue LPG (BRC sequential)
    sold: 2000 4.6 Vogue LPG (BRC sequential) (bought at 88k, sold at 176k)

  6. #5
    FRESHMAN ROVER
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    May 28th, 2009
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    Alton, Hampshire. UK.
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    Re: LPG conversion

    I've used AMS Autogas in Arlesford following recommendations. They seem to know their Rangeys quite well.

    My system was already fitted when I bought my Rangey, but it was running terribly. Took them a while, but they managed to sort it out - needed new injector blocks and a proper setting up.

    http://www.amsautogas.com/

    Guy
    1998 Range Rover 4.6 HSE with Lpg

  7. #6
    SOPHOMORE ROVER
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    Berkshire, England
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    Re: LPG conversion

    Quote Originally Posted by q-rover
    Is it worth it?
    The value of the vehicle can't be that much now, and it will take quite a few miles
    to be able to recoup the cost of the installation.
    Given the price of petrol, the payback is probably a lot shorter than you imagine. Obviously I don't know what mileage you do, but if you think that a saving of £40 a week on fuel equates to £2k a year, the numbers stack up pretty quickly.
    Danny

    '94 RRC V8, 3.9 auto Vogue, LPG.

    Estne volumen in toga, an solum tibi libet me videre?

  8. #7
    SENIOR ROVER q-rover's Avatar
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    Re: LPG conversion

    I do about 10.000Km/ year and LPG is barely available here.
    1998 Autobiography 4.6 V8 of course

  9. #8
    SOPHOMORE ROVER
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    January 10th, 2009
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    Leicestershire, England
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    Re: LPG conversion

    I can recommend JE Engineering, they fitted mine. Did a good job. I don't think it took them 5 days (got a courtesy car anyway) and it only cost me £1200. however some of the stuff was already fitted like the tank due to a previous system being fitted.

    With the mileage I do it was costing me about £100 a week in petrol give or take a bit, on gas it costs about £40 a week so I would say I'm well out of the red in terms of the cost of fitting the LPG as it was about a year ago now. I have a donut tank in the wheel well, I usually carry my spare in the boot its big and heavy so its quite handy as I put items inside it so they don't slide around the boot.
    http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4005/...3b6608cf_o.jpg

    If at first you donít succeed, get a bigger hammer.
    If you canít fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

  10. #9
    FRESHMAN ROVER
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    August 30th, 2005
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    Essex UK
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    214

    Re: LPG conversion

    Have a think about DIY. I did a little write with picture that you may find interesting. It is a sweet system and realy is flawless in operation you only what fuel its running on by the LED on the switch.

    http://www.landyzone.co.uk/lz/f10/gassed-up-61009.html
    2002 Vogue - just as the good Lode intended.........

  11. #10
    JUNIOR ROVER
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    Alton Hampshire UK/Cape Town SA
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    Re: LPG conversion

    Thanks Gents for your replies.Will definitely only install a mulitpoint sequential system when I do it.AS for DIY,I dont think I am up for that<what with having to work outside(RR wont fit through garage entrance),I dont think it is practical for me.

    The odd think I have come up against is not what I expected,is that there no local suppliers of LPG.Nearest seems to be 10 miles away and none on the usual routes I travel.So it looks as if it might cost more in mileage just to fill up with LPG each time.
    John W
    1995 4.6hse
    Enjoy it!!

  12. #11
    LEGACY VENDOR 996TURBO's Avatar
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    September 27th, 2006
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    Paris, FRANCE
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    2,524

    Re: LPG conversion

    In your case, i'd advise you to look well at the RPI Engineering LPG tank setups.
    No bootspace loss and great range.
    I prefer not comment their choice of ring mixer install versus multipoint sequential
    1997 P38 4.6
    LPG
    SD L322 Rack adapted to P38
    DC5000 EAS Compressor
    Arnott Gen3
    RR-EVOLUTION protection for P38 : front diff guard, rear diff guard, steering guard, fuel tank
    32 inch BF KM2 tires
    Custom Mantec Snorkel
    RPI Sport Exhaust
    H4 Bixenons bulbs

  13. #12
    JUNIOR ROVER
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    Alton Hampshire UK/Cape Town SA
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    Re: LPG conversion

    Quote Originally Posted by 996TURBO
    In your case, i'd advise you to look well at the RPI Engineering LPG tank setups.
    No bootspace loss and great range.
    I prefer not comment their choice of ring mixer install versus multipoint sequential

    Ok I will bite,as I am just learning about LPG,please do comment and explain the difference and dis/advantages of either.
    John W
    1995 4.6hse
    Enjoy it!!

  14. #13
    FRESHMAN ROVER
    Join Date
    August 30th, 2005
    Location
    Essex UK
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    214

    Re: LPG conversion

    Did my conversion in the street...
    Seriously wouldnt even consider a non sequential system, there is a world of difference from these and the mixer ring type. Go for a sequentail with with a connection to the OBD socket. These follow the petrol ECU exactly and allow for the fuel trims on the petrol ECU.
    2002 Vogue - just as the good Lode intended.........

  15. #14
    FRESHMAN ROVER
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    February 26th, 2009
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    181

    Re: LPG conversion

    A couple of other factors which might influence the decision in our part of the world is the increased range when travelling long distances and the (non) availability of high RON fuel in the outback. Also I hear anecdotally that they run much better so that alone is reason for doing it (cost aside).

    Like John W I would like to undertstand the difference in the systems better. I have a GEMS 98 but I have had a high spec engine rebuild so I don't want any cowboy drilling into my lovely new engine if there is a better (or just as good) way of doing it.

    Regards

    Andy

    (Melbourne)
    Melbourne, Australia
    1998 colour coded in Woodcote Green, complete high spec engine rebuild to 5.0l, Bilsteins, Gen IIIs, full stainless steel twin exhaust, Burr Walnut treatment by Silvercrest Design in UK, and some other bits and bobs

  16. #15
    JUNIOR ROVER
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    June 25th, 2007
    Location
    Wales, UK
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    517

    Re: LPG conversion

    Quote Originally Posted by John W
    Thanks Gents for your replies.Will definitely only install a mulitpoint sequential system when I do it.AS for DIY,I dont think I am up for that<what with having to work outside(RR wont fit through garage entrance),I dont think it is practical for me.
    I have had experience of 3 different types of conversions on our RR's.

    The first one we bought had a single point system installed. The next one had a non sequential multi point injection system and the 3rd system was a full multi point sequential system. This I fitted myself to replace the non-sequential system. I also did this outside on my driveway in a weekend, although I do admit this was only the front end as I could utilise the tank from the previous installation. If you do it yourself it's helpful to get one with a wiring loom that has Bosch connectors on the loom to the injectors - saves the hassle of cutting into the injector wiring harness and means you can easily disconnect and isolate the lpg system if required in the future.

    I would definitely only go for a full multipoint sequential kit as there was a considerable difference in the power and smoothness between the 3 types.
    I have also had a Saab turbo converted and currently have a Mercedes SL320 on lpg, again both with full sequential kits. The merc having the latest type that has been approved to Euro V emmissions.

    Probably more important than the individual kit is the quality of installation and calibration.
    In terms of kits Prinz is usually quoted as the best, but if you plan any DIY on the lpg system in the future you will find getting parts hard as they will only allow their authorised installers to fit them. Also if you want to spend time fine tuning the calibration they won't sell you a lead or allow access to their software (although you see aftermarket stuff on ebay). The biggest quality item on the Prinz is the Khein injectors, although if they ever go faulty you will need to pay an installer to replace them, and as they are on a rail you will have to replace the rail and not individual injectors.
    The other kits mainly fall into 2 camps - Italian made, usually based around AEB electroncis and Polish kits.Tanks are almost exclusively Polish in origin. All these use a vapouriser and inject lpg gas, there is also a system made by Vaille that injects liquid lpg in the same way liquid petrol is injected - if I'm correct Ford use this as a factory fit.
    You can buy kits from a few places including

    http://www.tinleytech.co.uk/acatalog/Ra ... r_P38.html (very helpful to speak to)
    http://www.autogasworldwide.co.uk/index.php - importers of Romano - you can enrol on a course to learn how to fit lpg taking your own car to convert
    http://www.blazegas.com/
    2000 P38 4.6 Vogue lpg
    1997 P38 4.6 HSE lpg - sold
    2000 Mercedes SL320 - lpg
    1976 Ford Gran Torino Starsky & Hutch Limited Edition (restoration project)
    1978 VW type 2 camper
    2000 Saab convertible lpg - sold
    1970 VW Beetle wizard convertible

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