M62 engine PCV seems to freeze up?

[heppsen]

Hi all,
I have a 2003, 4.4. V8 petrol Vogue and suffered some hard trouble last winter from an apparently frozen PCV system.
It frequently spilled oil from the left hand valve cover onto the manifold - which you can smell very clearly after a while.
It seemed to happen after cold damp nights, so the dealer checked the PCV hoses, the oil seperator, changed the valve cover seals 3 times,
changed the PCV hoses, the oil seperator and the complete valve assembly in the back of the intakte manifold last february.
After all, it was in the workshop about 6 times....
This was last winter. And I might remeber it being o.k. afzer the final change of the valve in the manifold back end. But might as
well had no frozy nights anymore afterwards.

Now tonight, we had the first frosty night again and it seemed to be happening again.
I had a very bad smell of burned oil aftre running a 7 km distance and parking it up at a shop.
After popping the bonnet and having the first quick check it smelled like burned oil quite clearly and the area underneath the left hand valve cover again is wet and oily...
Its were the cover sits on top of the cylinder head.
I have done a search in this forum and found some explanations of PCV hose changes etc.
So far so good. BUT! I also found a pic with what appears to be an electric heating blanket on the top PCV hoses.

Is this a genuine thing for cold areas or some aftermarket modification?

Help is much appreciated, as I seem to have a bad problem with this car not liking minus temperatures.
Apart from this it behaves well and without trouble so far.
Engine runs as intended, no warnings, no oil use, no water use, no funny behaviour.
I use it for long runs but do the occasional short trip as business makes it neccessary.
I bought it in may 09 and experienced the frist trouble last winter, and now it starts all again.

regards
heppsen

[RRPhil]

Microcat shows an electric blanket heater (at the bottom of the diagram) - part number LLJ000030 - but it doesn't state which markets it is used in.

Phil

[Stevemfr]

Hi heppsen,
Nice to see you here
The blanket is an OEM part. Here is the Microcat diagram:

and a pic


Someone (I believe it was Dan_UK_1984) posted that, although the PCV hoses had been replaced by the dealer, they had neglected to do the lower hose

probably because it was too hard to get to...

More info in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=35640&hilit=blanket#p275949

[Stevemfr]

Microcat shows an electric blanket heater (at the bottom of the diagram) - part number LLJ000030 - but it doesn't state which markets it is used in.

Phil

Beat me too it, Phil
Oh well. Unfortunately I have to work sometimes.

[heppsen]

Many thanks so far. (hi Steve!)
I had the valve, the two top hoses and the oil separator replaced last winter, in February to be exact.
I am not sure about the lower connection from the separator funnel towards the oil return pipe to the oil pan.
I will have the whole system checked on monday, so will report back afterwards.

We even had the oil pan removed last time and checked wether something is blocked from the return pipe, but obviuosly inside the warm workshop. we could not even
reproduce the fault.

I had the car serviced two weeks ago....

Anyway.. thanks for input.


If someone on here knows where the heater blanket is connected to and how it is switched on/off, I would appreciate to hear this.

regards
TrueS2

[Dan_UK_1984]

There is a 4th hose in the PCV system that goes from the valve itself to the return pipe (6C342B on diagrams above), you should check the condition of this hose as well as the return hose from the bottom of the cyclone.

In theory the only way your PCV system can freeze is if it actually has water in it, oil itself is not going to freeze solid. An open to air PCV system will suck in cold moist air which can lead to further problems. I've never been particularly familiar with the heated blanket, but I know I've not seen it on a UK spec car, I can also find no mention of it in RAVE. I would search for info on this on the BMW forums as this is a very common topic over there.

It may also be worth considering the PCV Valve itself, this comprises of a rubber diaphragm and a spring. You can replace it, but you have to do the whole unit and it's a fiddly job.

How cold is it where you are? My 4.4 has no problems starting and running at -12C (without FBH )

Dan

PS, more info on the PCV System here: http://www.fullfatrr.com/wiki/PCV_Hose_Repair

[herman maire]

I just bought all new pipes as I have been smelling fumes when I came to a stop and the exhaust was not the problem. I inspected my pipes and the 2 large ones looked like used bubble gum.... I have never seen a pipe turned to bubble gum.

I bought all new pipes and I also bought the valve also . the valve Cost $60.

As for how cold it can get.... In the mornings its not uncommon to see -45c or more with the wind.

[Dan_UK_1984]

I just bought all new pipes as I have been smelling fumes when I came to a stop and the exhaust was not the problem. I inspected my pipes and the 2 large ones looked like used bubble gum.... I have never seen a pipe turned to bubble gum.

I bought all new pipes and I also bought the valve also . the valve Cost $60.

As for how cold it can get.... In the mornings its not uncommon to see -45c or more with the wind.

You got a good price on the valve, definately this bit?

[herman maire]

Dan,

In the diagram, I was sold the part# 6B673 (The trumpet looking part). I thought that was the problem part with the vacuum valve . Should I have bought the part you posted in the picture?

My brother had this same problem with a 528, something in the PVC system froze when it was really cold and it spewed oil everywhere. The new valve/part had a insulator around the pipe, I guess to retain heat.

[Dan_UK_1984]

Dan,

In the diagram, I was sold the part# 6B673 . I thought that was the problem part with the vacuum valve . Should I have bought the part you posted in the picture?

Careful using the short codes because they are not part numbers. The part number for 6B673 is LLP000010 and should cost around £20, this is not the PCV Valve but the Oil Separator (cyclone).

The part I posted a picture of above is part# LKR000040 This should cost around £60, not sure what that works out in terms of $$.

Dan

[heppsen]

Hi Dan,
thanks for updating this. I had the valve (complete assembly) replaced in february, as I neared 15oooo kms and as far as I
learned from the severla bimmer forums, its not a bad idea to renew this around this milage figure. As I had trouble with the PCV system anyway
I went for replacing it.
Did not help for long as I figure out now.

Its -8 Celsius at the moment during the night. Range is parked in a two sides closed carport.
Has been used on short trips the two days before, so might have built up some condensation.
Then I went home on thursday evening from a weeks work off home and did 120 km in one trip.
So thought the condensation should have been gone by then.

Anyway, it must be something in the pipes around the oil separator and the return pipe, as I am sure the rest is new and in good nick,
This will be checked on monday and I will report back.
I am glad to hear that a RR can cope with cold temperatures generally....

regards and thanks again
heppsen

[Dan_UK_1984]

The only complaint I have is with the wipers, they freeze solid so dont bend to the contours of the screen. They do Winter Wipers though, but at £40 they're too rich for me!

[heppsen]

I do have a heated front screen, no issues with the wipers so far...

regards
heppsen

[RRToadHall]

Here's a shot from another thread that shows the heater and what those pipes look like when they fail.

[herman maire]

[quote=Dan_UK_1984][quote="herman maire":3caxxjiw]I just bought all new pipes as I have been smelling fumes when I came to a stop and the exhaust was not the problem. I inspected my pipes and the 2 large ones looked like used bubble gum.... I have never seen a pipe turned to bubble gum.

I bought all new pipes and I also bought the valve also . the valve Cost $60.

As for how cold it can get.... In the mornings its not uncommon to see -45c or more with the wind.[/quote]

You got a good price on the valve, definately this bit?

[/quote:3caxxjiw]

Does anybody know if the part pictured is the same on a BMW ? If it is, what years work? I checked and this parts costs $220. Is that to much $$. I bought a new cyclone but will be returning it for the correct valve.

[url="http://parts.autopartsonlinecanada.com/parts/apocanada/wizard.jsp?year=2003&make=BM&model=X5--002&category=B&part=Intake+Manifold+Cover"]http://parts.autopartsonlinecanada.com/ ... fold+Cover[/url]